Complex Anime
Would you do her?
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Most everyone has run into one, the anime that makes you say "WTF!?" The ones where you want to kill someone because you were enjoying the series then it goes comepletely incoherent on you. So which anime was one that made you confused? I'm also hoping for people to debate on what the real meaning behind some anime are...
Mine would have to be Serial Experiments Lain. I don't think anyone can figure out the real meaning behind that series. I understood NGE better than that show.
Mine would have to be Serial Experiments Lain. I don't think anyone can figure out the real meaning behind that series. I understood NGE better than that show.
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Lain was simple to understand. All you had to do was accept the fact that everything was fucked up, and then it would dawn on you that 99% of the effort per episode is directed towards confusing you.
Me...
~Shuffle. What the fuck, they get to the fucking "Adam and Eve" scene on the deserted island, with promises of "We'll be together forever", and suddenly BAM, switch over to Asa? Ugh.
~Macross Frontier. Ok, wait. So she's the next minmei and her song can influence the Vajra BUT she's being watched over by some half-shadowy organization made up of cyborgs and half-vajra chimera, who want to use her singing's latent ability to manipulate folds in space/time to achive some sort of large scale something?
I'm a fairly perceptive person, so when Anime tried to be confusing, it usually fails against me. Those two, though...ugh.
Me...
~Shuffle. What the fuck, they get to the fucking "Adam and Eve" scene on the deserted island, with promises of "We'll be together forever", and suddenly BAM, switch over to Asa? Ugh.
~Macross Frontier. Ok, wait. So she's the next minmei and her song can influence the Vajra BUT she's being watched over by some half-shadowy organization made up of cyborgs and half-vajra chimera, who want to use her singing's latent ability to manipulate folds in space/time to achive some sort of large scale something?
I'm a fairly perceptive person, so when Anime tried to be confusing, it usually fails against me. Those two, though...ugh.
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:arrow:
did the poll have anything to do with the actual topic, :?
there're no real meanings behind any anime, well, as long as u don't get too into it, i simply look at it as a form of entertainment composed of a fictional storyline and some fantasized animated characters rather than reality tv shows. The majority of animes tend to express the ideology of either "justice will overcome evil" or "friendship is beauty", stuff like that, it's all hypothetical and fictional, i don't think the parts that make u confused had anything to do with the key concept of what the show's trying to tell u, maybe because of some lame director's idea of "art" or their perspective on how the script should be acted is pretty messed up. And just in case, if u can't comprehend the meaning or the incoherency of certain animes like SEL, there's always wikipedia, actually, now i think of it, after finishing NGE, i almost read all the contents NGE related on wiki, man that's a lot.
the only scene that led me go "WTF" was in the NGE movie, whereas Shinji supposedly fapped to the naked image of Asuka in the hospital, now that is real fucked up.
EDIT: if a show's gone nuts like u said, go back and watch it again. the parts u understand is probably intended to express the same point as the parts that u don't understand, just like every essay has a central thesis, every show always has a major concept or statement intended for the viewers like us.
did the poll have anything to do with the actual topic, :?
there're no real meanings behind any anime, well, as long as u don't get too into it, i simply look at it as a form of entertainment composed of a fictional storyline and some fantasized animated characters rather than reality tv shows. The majority of animes tend to express the ideology of either "justice will overcome evil" or "friendship is beauty", stuff like that, it's all hypothetical and fictional, i don't think the parts that make u confused had anything to do with the key concept of what the show's trying to tell u, maybe because of some lame director's idea of "art" or their perspective on how the script should be acted is pretty messed up. And just in case, if u can't comprehend the meaning or the incoherency of certain animes like SEL, there's always wikipedia, actually, now i think of it, after finishing NGE, i almost read all the contents NGE related on wiki, man that's a lot.
the only scene that led me go "WTF" was in the NGE movie, whereas Shinji supposedly fapped to the naked image of Asuka in the hospital, now that is real fucked up.
EDIT: if a show's gone nuts like u said, go back and watch it again. the parts u understand is probably intended to express the same point as the parts that u don't understand, just like every essay has a central thesis, every show always has a major concept or statement intended for the viewers like us.
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I have watched a very bad anime 2-3 years ago. It was called Avanger, and after I watched the series (13 episodes, it was like trapped in a slaughterhouse, but I don't like to stop halfway), and after it ended, I said "Just what hell was the story about?". For me, that anime doesn't make any sense at all.
I think Lain good if you watch it from a good "angle". True, you have to watch it over and over.
I think Lain good if you watch it from a good "angle". True, you have to watch it over and over.
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No, polls just make threads more fun.
I have watched lain multiple times, and that is the problem. I've never had trouble understanding anime except this one. As for anime not having any meaning, I believe there is. The only reason it's hard for us to understand is they're symbolism and meaning is different from ours, and therefor harder to understand.
As for Shinji fapping to Asuka, yeah that was fucked up. But it was funny.
Me...
~Shuffle. What the fuck, they get to the fucking "Adam and Eve" scene on the deserted island, with promises of "We'll be together forever", and suddenly BAM, switch over to Asa? Ugh.
~Macross Frontier. Ok, wait. So she's the next minmei and her song can influence the Vajra BUT she's being watched over by some half-shadowy organization made up of cyborgs and half-vajra chimera, who want to use her singing's latent ability to manipulate folds in space/time to achive some sort of large scale something?
I'm a fairly perceptive person, so when Anime tried to be confusing, it usually fails against me. Those two, though...ugh.
Lol, I might have to agree on that because no matter how you look at it Lain just doesn't make sense. My friends think they know what it means but I think it's BS.
For Shuffle I was actually for Asa being the one he ended up with so in the end I was happy, but yeah that was a bit odd that they switched him to another character after all that shit.
I have watched lain multiple times, and that is the problem. I've never had trouble understanding anime except this one. As for anime not having any meaning, I believe there is. The only reason it's hard for us to understand is they're symbolism and meaning is different from ours, and therefor harder to understand.
As for Shinji fapping to Asuka, yeah that was fucked up. But it was funny.
Arizth wrote...
Lain was simple to understand. All you had to do was accept the fact that everything was fucked up, and then it would dawn on you that 99% of the effort per episode is directed towards confusing you.Me...
~Shuffle. What the fuck, they get to the fucking "Adam and Eve" scene on the deserted island, with promises of "We'll be together forever", and suddenly BAM, switch over to Asa? Ugh.
~Macross Frontier. Ok, wait. So she's the next minmei and her song can influence the Vajra BUT she's being watched over by some half-shadowy organization made up of cyborgs and half-vajra chimera, who want to use her singing's latent ability to manipulate folds in space/time to achive some sort of large scale something?
I'm a fairly perceptive person, so when Anime tried to be confusing, it usually fails against me. Those two, though...ugh.
Lol, I might have to agree on that because no matter how you look at it Lain just doesn't make sense. My friends think they know what it means but I think it's BS.
For Shuffle I was actually for Asa being the one he ended up with so in the end I was happy, but yeah that was a bit odd that they switched him to another character after all that shit.
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Nate River wrote...
there're no real meanings behind any anime, well, as long as u don't get too into it, i simply look at it as a form of entertainment composed of a fictional storyline and some fantasized animated characters rather than reality tv shows.
it depends on your context of 'meanings' that either has me siding with you or completely disagreeing. if you mean a true meaning as a medium, there usually isnt. its a cartoon with unusually energetic character expressions and a strong foundation of the bizarre. thanks to the influence from japanese culture most anime present a unique formula... but dont they all.
if you mean the intended message however then in my opinion your completely wrong, a strong amount of anime have an ideology outside of the unreal and usually a lesson to learn somewhere throughout. just because the concepts are emphatic and unbound by natural law doesnt mean theyre unatainable, they usually arent too unconventional either. alot of them could be implicated with a little effort, for instance: trigun and vashs mentality of love and peace is very attainable. unfortunately it takes the collaboration of a majority to really change a society or belief systems, and theres never enough people who contribute their say or give a damn.
Nate River wrote...
the only scene that led me go "WTF" was in the NGE movie, whereas Shinji supposedly fapped to the naked image of Asuka in the hospital, now that is real fucked up.
the naked image? hows about the naked asuka? lol nge is full of metaphors and religous symbolism but im not quite sure how relevant this was to the story as a whole. probably about the epitimy of human expression... i dont fucking know. i think theres something more to it but untill i find out ill just think of it as funny.
edit: oh shit right, my wtf moments.
gantz ending: if anyones seen the anime they know what im talking about. i mean, what the fuck? did he win, die, become jesus? i dont know if one choice is safe to assume in comparison to the next.
paranoia agent: the entire series was an enticing psychological thriller that had a realistic crime solving phase to it. but then somewhere along the line, it turns from probable causes to weird bastards fighting big fuck off monsters in a battle of justice versus personified evil of misleading intentions.
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(>'.')>¿;= wrote...
it depends on your context of 'meanings' that either has me siding with you or completely disagreeing. if you mean a true meaning as a medium, there usually isnt. its a cartoon with unusually energetic character expressions and a strong foundation of the bizarre. thanks to the influence from japanese culture most anime present a unique formula... but dont they all.if you mean the intended message however then in my opinion your completely wrong, a strong amount of anime have an ideology outside of the unreal and usually a lesson to learn somewhere throughout. just because the concepts are emphatic and unbound by natural law doesnt mean theyre unatainable, they usually arent too unconventional either. alot of them could be implicated with a little effort, for instance: trigun and vashs mentality of love and peace is very attainable. unfortunately it takes the collaboration of a majority to really change a society or belief systems, and theres never enough people who contribute their say or give a damn.
Totally agreed.
(>'.')>¿;= wrote...
paranoia agent: the entire series was an enticing psychological thriller that had a realistic crime solving phase to it. but then somewhere along the line, it turns from probable causes to weird bastards fighting big fuck off monsters in a battle of justice versus personified evil of misleading intentions.Yeah, this one has a reputation for being a WTF anime. All my friends who have watched it say it's good til WTF mode and after watching Lain it's discouraged me from watching it.
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(>'.')>¿;= wrote...
[quote="Nate River"]there're no real meanings behind any anime, well, as long as u don't get too into it, i simply look at it as a form of entertainment composed of a fictional storyline and some fantasized animated characters rather than reality tv shows.
Elfen Lied had alot of meanings i jus can't remember them i know some are like:
>the dark side of human nature
>how we cast out someone jus for being different
can't think this cold is killin me
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Fiction is among the highest forms of art and the currently greatest means to promote philosophical thoughts unbound from our reality. The more alien it is to our world, the more freedom from the creators part, and the better escapism it can offer. And the more unreal it is, the more strange knowledge can be acquired from learning about that world. It's rather handy.
And about Serial Experiments Lain... I cannot let your ignorant comments pass!
It does not only provide the most mindblowing entertainment to be found present day present time, it also promotes interesting actual theories on consciousness and life on earth.
I suggest you read Peter Russell's "The Global Brain", aswell as Lovelocks Gaia theory. "Cyberia: Life in the trenches of cyberspace" by Douglas Rushkoff is also good reading, and can be downloaded for free.
Good site about SEL for references to futher reading.
Can't really be bothered to write more myself, but saying Lain was without meaning is blasphemy. I got a brighter way of seeing life from that serie, as I now see more value in working for the growth of the global brain.
And about Serial Experiments Lain... I cannot let your ignorant comments pass!
It does not only provide the most mindblowing entertainment to be found present day present time, it also promotes interesting actual theories on consciousness and life on earth.
I suggest you read Peter Russell's "The Global Brain", aswell as Lovelocks Gaia theory. "Cyberia: Life in the trenches of cyberspace" by Douglas Rushkoff is also good reading, and can be downloaded for free.
Good site about SEL for references to futher reading.
Can't really be bothered to write more myself, but saying Lain was without meaning is blasphemy. I got a brighter way of seeing life from that serie, as I now see more value in working for the growth of the global brain.
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I agree that most shows have a meaning, but Lain delievered that meaning in such a confusing way, maybe I'm just an ignorant bastard, but understanding Evangelion wasn't even that hard.
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I guess I'd do ehr since she is cute, but I'm not really a loli fan. I mean lil girls...eh maybe sometimes.
Yeah in Code Geass in season 1, there was a scene where it did a few flash close up pics of Nina and she was moving and sweating. Afterwards Milly comes in to see ehr in a dark room next to teh table. I was like WTF!? "Did seh jsut rub her pussy against the table while thinking of Euphemia or am I jsut seeing this teh wrong way"?
Yeah in Code Geass in season 1, there was a scene where it did a few flash close up pics of Nina and she was moving and sweating. Afterwards Milly comes in to see ehr in a dark room next to teh table. I was like WTF!? "Did seh jsut rub her pussy against the table while thinking of Euphemia or am I jsut seeing this teh wrong way"?
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All fiction confuses the reader/listener/viewer, or atleast all I've experienced. Sure, you could read the ending and it could be quite clear to you, but the fun mostly comes from putting pieces together and get involved with the story.
Lain is just taking it abit futher than other animes, maybe to get us even more involved and fascinated, and possibly because it doesn't present any simplified black-white scenarios. And we are noway near understanding the nature of consciouness yet, and no 13-episode anime could do that. Lain contains lots of references to futher reading and is like everything else not complete in itself, but requieres the viewer to be interested.
Lain is just taking it abit futher than other animes, maybe to get us even more involved and fascinated, and possibly because it doesn't present any simplified black-white scenarios. And we are noway near understanding the nature of consciouness yet, and no 13-episode anime could do that. Lain contains lots of references to futher reading and is like everything else not complete in itself, but requieres the viewer to be interested.
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(>'.')>¿;= wrote...
Nate River wrote...
there're no real meanings behind any anime, well, as long as u don't get too into it, i simply look at it as a form of entertainment composed of a fictional storyline and some fantasized animated characters rather than reality tv shows.
it depends on your context of 'meanings' that either has me siding with you or completely disagreeing. if you mean a true meaning as a medium, there usually isnt. its a cartoon with unusually energetic character expressions and a strong foundation of the bizarre. thanks to the influence from japanese culture most anime present a unique formula... but dont they all.
if you mean the intended message however then in my opinion your completely wrong, a strong amount of anime have an ideology outside of the unreal and usually a lesson to learn somewhere throughout. just because the concepts are emphatic and unbound by natural law doesnt mean theyre unatainable, they usually arent too unconventional either. alot of them could be implicated with a little effort, for instance: trigun and vashs mentality of love and peace is very attainable. unfortunately it takes the collaboration of a majority to really change a society or belief systems, and theres never enough people who contribute their say or give a damn.
Nate River wrote...
the only scene that led me go "WTF" was in the NGE movie, whereas Shinji supposedly fapped to the naked image of Asuka in the hospital, now that is real fucked up.
the naked image? hows about the naked asuka? lol nge is full of metaphors and religous symbolism but im not quite sure how relevant this was to the story as a whole. probably about the epitimy of human expression... i dont fucking know. i think theres something more to it but untill i find out ill just think of it as funny.
edit: oh shit right, my wtf moments.
gantz ending: if anyones seen the anime they know what im talking about. i mean, what the fuck? did he win, die, become jesus? i dont know if one choice is safe to assume in comparison to the next.
paranoia agent: the entire series was an enticing psychological thriller that had a realistic crime solving phase to it. but then somewhere along the line, it turns from probable causes to weird bastards fighting big fuck off monsters in a battle of justice versus personified evil of misleading intentions.
:arrow:
well, how should i explain this, meanings as meanings in relation to the realistic concept of change, the constant evolution of thoughts, normally we watch anime as entertainments, later on in life we forget about it(unless as i said, u're really "into" it), we go back and review, it's a story, a fictionalized, unreal piece of artistic work, it's meaning to us remain ambiguous, around the circle of uncertainty, yes sometimes we get affected by these stories in various ways, but time goes on, day after day, year after year, river flows as if nothing had changed, but everything had already, materialistic items or imaginative ideas are the creation of man, from a certain point of view, they possess no
"exact" meanings to them, ok, maybe i went too far, but u'll get it.
but ideas, central concepts and thesis do exist in every anime and possibly in fact in every story, main characters go through their ways to prove something to us and that's what u guys interpreted as "meanings", in fact, they are generally meanings, but i'm just me, i've had my own way of goin at things, and those are my opinions, probably not correct according to the social standards, but if we look at things the other way around, how do u define "correct", really?
and as for the N.G.E, the WTF moment is when i saw the sperm on Shinji's hands, and Shinji goes "i'm fucked up", i get cracked up everytime i see that scene, u know what i mean, right? :lol:
@Elfen Lied, I'm pretending to be philosophical, i made the thread for Elfen Lied and talked a lot about it, i hope u'll comment on that anytime soon
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Nate River wrote...
:arrow:
well, how should i explain this, meanings as meanings in relation to the realistic concept of change, the constant evolution of thoughts, normally we watch anime as entertainments, later on in life we forget about it(unless as i said, u're really "into" it), we go back and review, it's a story, a fictionalized, unreal piece of artistic work, it's meaning to us remain ambiguous, around the circle of uncertainty, yes sometimes we get affected by these stories in various ways, but time goes on, day after day, year after year, river flows as if nothing had changed, but everything had already, materialistic items or imaginative ideas are the creation of man, from a certain point of view, they possess no
"exact" meanings to them, ok, maybe i went too far, but u'll get it.
but ideas, central concepts and thesis do exist in every anime and possibly in fact in every story, main characters go through their ways to prove something to us and that's what u guys interpreted as "meanings", in fact, they are generally meanings, but i'm just me, i've had my own way of goin at things, and those are my opinions, probably not correct according to the social standards, but if we look at things the other way around, how do u define "correct", really?
and as for the N.G.E, the WTF moment is when i saw the sperm on Shinji's hands, and Shinji goes "i'm fucked up", i get cracked up everytime i see that scene, u know what i mean, right? :lol:
@Elfen Lied, I'm pretending to be philosophical, i made the thread for Elfen Lied and talked a lot about it, i hope u'll comment on that anytime soon
Well, I think most every director, not just of anime, start a series or movie trying to get a message across. It doesn't have to be deep, but I don't think it's just for entertainment. Even the new movie Wall*E which was for kids, had a meaning behind it. I'm not saying it's bad to watch series just for entertainment sake, but I think there are definately messages if you look harder. As the joker said, "It's not about the money, it's about sending a message." XD (Of course it's about money too but whatever)
Coming back to Lain, the problem is I wasn't talking about catching a meaning. It didn't even appeal to me as entertaining since I didn't even understand the fucking plot...
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PersonDude wrote...
Nate River wrote...
:arrow:
well, how should i explain this, meanings as meanings in relation to the realistic concept of change, the constant evolution of thoughts, normally we watch anime as entertainments, later on in life we forget about it(unless as i said, u're really "into" it), we go back and review, it's a story, a fictionalized, unreal piece of artistic work, it's meaning to us remain ambiguous, around the circle of uncertainty, yes sometimes we get affected by these stories in various ways, but time goes on, day after day, year after year, river flows as if nothing had changed, but everything had already, materialistic items or imaginative ideas are the creation of man, from a certain point of view, they possess no
"exact" meanings to them, ok, maybe i went too far, but u'll get it.
but ideas, central concepts and thesis do exist in every anime and possibly in fact in every story, main characters go through their ways to prove something to us and that's what u guys interpreted as "meanings", in fact, they are generally meanings, but i'm just me, i've had my own way of goin at things, and those are my opinions, probably not correct according to the social standards, but if we look at things the other way around, how do u define "correct", really?
and as for the N.G.E, the WTF moment is when i saw the sperm on Shinji's hands, and Shinji goes "i'm fucked up", i get cracked up everytime i see that scene, u know what i mean, right? :lol:
@Elfen Lied, I'm pretending to be philosophical, i made the thread for Elfen Lied and talked a lot about it, i hope u'll comment on that anytime soon
Well, I think most every director, not just of anime, start a series or movie trying to get a message across. It doesn't have to be deep, but I don't think it's just for entertainment. Even the new movie Wall*E which was for kids, had a meaning behind it. I'm not saying it's bad to watch series just for entertainment sake, but I think there are definately messages if you look harder. As the joker said, "It's not about the money, it's about sending a message." XD (Of course it's about money too but whatever)
Coming back to Lain, the problem is I wasn't talking about catching a meaning. It didn't even appeal to me as entertaining since I didn't even understand the fucking plot...
:arrow:
have u checked wiki yet?
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tsujoi wrote...
TECHNOLYZE maybe? yes? no?I fucking loved it. It does get a little confusing when they go up to the surface, but somehow I managed to figure it out.
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The Jesus wrote...
tsujoi wrote...
TECHNOLYZE maybe? yes? no?I fucking loved it. It does get a little confusing when they go up to the surface, but somehow I managed to figure it out.
One of my all-time fav anime's. Amazing show on so many levels.