what happens after we die?

Precision young man!! 'pi' or 'e' may be considered as irrational in some mathematical context, But that does not mean choosing such a number is considered irrational! Though you would be an ass**** if you did think of such a number in a number picking game..

And my apologies if you do not consider yourself young.

Its never good to be a smartass with the man at the door...

Death......Afterlife......religion.....reincarnation.....atheism. Whatever you wish to think. believe or deny, the fact as you all know, is that none of us truly know.

As we are the only known creatures to have our capabilites of the mind, it's understandable that we fear death. It is an unkown, an enigma, the only thing guaranteed to our lives.

My personality is the cynic, the pessemist, the questioner and the challenger.
Now, do keep in mind this is just speculation with no evidence. However, I have imagined form many year's now, that the theme's of relgion were created solely for the purpose of promoting both control and stability. Through the use of our own fears. Fear of death, fear of what we are capable of, fear of what others are capable of.

Turn on your television, look at an ad, what do you see?
Someone selling you their product?
Wrong. In reality, we see someone selling to our fear of living without their product,. Products to promote "beauty", to keep us "young", to make us strong, or intelligent. To make things "easier".

As such, religion to me, is just another invention of man from age old times to control the masses. Frankly it's genius if you think of it this way, just imagine the power such ideals hold over us. Of course, this is just speculation, so do take it with a grain of salt, yeah?

Some food for thought from a topic on http://richarddawkins.net/.

Some bits are relevant.

YOU CAN'T HAVE A SERIOUS OPINION ON THE SUBJECT WITHOUT SOMEONE ELSE BEING OFFENDED.


i THINK YOU GET THE OPTION TO ENJOY A NICE BOWL.

What I hope is that I'll turn to a ghost and just remain on Earth.

I don't know, really. I'm still trying to accept the possibility of dying and not-existing and it's pretty hard. It'd make me feel better if I truly believed in something like an afterlife, something like a safety-net. But you never know, there may be.

wow... never did expect so many replies.

hm... while my religion says there's heaven and hell and tells us what we must do to get into heaven, I find myself wondering if its really true or not. It definitely would be nice if there was an "afterlife" but without confirmation we just can't tell, short of digging up someone from a grave and interrogating the corpse (not recommended).



However, I do gather that everyone here has an underlying point. Whatever our beliefs, religion etc... We all should do our best to live life to the fullest right?


Of course, making an impact in someone else's life would be a very BIG plus.

You say it is not recommended to dig up and interrogating corpses... so it seems like you have experience.. so share some of that, I am curious :P

This is a stupid comment that I see many of you make or seem to believe. Reincarnation is NOT a religion. It is part of some religious believes like Buddhism and Hindusim, but it is not a belief by itself, and just because you believe in it it doesn't make you religious.

As I said earlier, I believe in a form of reincarnation, but I do not consider myself religious because of it, I just think this is how it is, since I personally really can't imagine how it would be to not exist, your consciousness has to go Somewhere, or you start up as a new consciousness. This has nothing to do with your "soul traveling to another body" either.

There is no scientific reason for why "nothingness" would be the logical explanation.

It is fallacious reasoning like this that has people making such hasty conclusions. How disappointing.

Nothing happens. Your consciousness ceases to exist when your brain stops functioning. Your body will, through natural processes, decompose and be reused by nature. The materials that make up your body will continue to exist for eons in one form or another. And thats it.

Now as a self-conscious being, I can understand why people would want to believe in afterlives and reincarnation. The thought of ceasing to exist and losing your consciousness forever is disturbing, so people would want to believe that their consciousness or "the soul" transcends, or at least continues to exist post-mortem. This is a recurring theme among all religious belief systems. Afterlife for Judeo-Christianity and Islam, reincarnation for the more eastern religions, and that doesn't even include pre-christian religions like the Greek, Egyptian, and other ancient polytheistic mythologies, all of which have at least one "God of the afterlife" in their pantheon. The meme of the continual existence of "the soul" is a highly appealing among people who are afraid of death and even more so when they are on the verge of it.

Personally, I find it easier to face a horrifying truth than to conveniently lie to myself that everything is okay. I also can accept that nobody truly knows what happens after death, and I would gladly change my tentative belief anytime if anyone can convince me otherwise. But hey, maybe if the Mayans are right all of humanity might simultaneously find out in 2012.

tl;dr warning on this.



Hmh? I can throw that right back at you. I never said that I know what I believe is right, neither am I saying that the "turning into nothingness" can't be true either. This is no hasty conclusion of any sort. I can just not imagine how non-existence would be, and therefor, I don't believe it, and won't until I die an can tell by myself. I mean, it should impossible for anyone to imagine, since no one has ever experienced it and can tell the living people how it is. To me, starting again as another conscious being sounds much more likely. Reincarnation in this case does not mean that I think our new consciousness have any relation to the one we have now though; we are not the same person, we have not "lived an earlier life" or anything like that.

Just because this "nothingness" is the belief of the biased majority of the religion-fearing population in the western world, it does not make it true. The majority isn't always right, especially when they blindly believe what people say (this is the same for atheist believing in scientists and religious people believing in priests) and set their belief fully against any that can involve religion cuz they fear being branded if they don't.



What I wonder is; what happens then? It's not like you spend an eternity seeing black? Screw the body, that has nothing to do with it, and screw the soul as well, that might just as well not exist. "Nothing happens then, that's just it." is not an explanation or anything; that is just something you can say because you do not know what happens and can't imagine it, so you stop your thoughts there, since that is easier.



As I said, something like a "soul" has nothing to do with it. Disturbing? Not really, in fact, right now I feel like I would welcome non-existence. I do not believe in 'reincarnation' because that is how I want it to be, I believe in it because it seems much more logical to me. If we put this in scientific terms for you witch-burning atheists then: Matter can not just "cease to be", it never disappear, it always just turns into something else.



What makes this the truth? And what makes it horrifying? -_- This is more likely a response to people who does not want to live their crappy lives again (and I can relate to them) and therefore says "The End" to be relieved from thinking any further. This is something even more pseudoscience than the existence of God. And saying "I will change my belief if there is a truth of the opposite" is exactly the same argument that people say about God, or ghosts, or w/e, and Death can not even compare to these since it no doubt exist, all will no doubt has to face it, and there is NO logical reasoning that ANY SCIENTIST can make to reach the truth.

What I'm getting to is:
@Rbz: I know you quote TAA and say that "The absence of evidence is not the evidence of absence" is wrong, but that does not apply here as much as it does to God. There is nothing you can say in this case that makes what you believe (Yes, it is a BELIEF, just like God) any more true OR logical than any other belief; on the contrary, what I said about matter would make this belief scientifically illogical.

@Fascistznik: Saying that you face "the horrifying truth" just because You Believe Its Is True is the same as anyone else saying that Santa is exist because they believe he does.

touche that is true. but the way the person said the statment i just wanted to state that its in other religion. i just didnt say it right.

Fallacious reasoning nonetheless, methinks.

I'm amused at how you liken Priests to Scientists, because it's not like the opinions of scientists are based on research, evidence, and reason. The thing is, "nothingness" is the most reasonable explanation. Based on the findings of science, we have discovered that the material brain directly effects consciousness. What that means is, if we fuck around with someone's brain a bit, we can make them feel and think differently. The "ghost in the machine (soul)" is a superfluous explanation for the consciousness of human beings. Basically, "souls" aren't necessary.

You should read all I said instead. I already said that a "soul" whether it exist or not has nothing to do with it. "Nothingness" is not reasonable in any sense at all, its just as much a belief that cannot be researched and proven. The comparison between priests and scientists was just to show the relation to how atheists and religious people believe in what other people who claims they know the truth says. I can also say that I'm pretty sure that there is a lot of scientists with a lot of different believes on what happens after death.

You're acting as if the atheist community of fakku is attacking you. Chill the fuck out.

Consciousness is a bunch of signals being sent through neurons. Consciousness ceases to be when the brain stops sending these signals. Matter is not being created nor destroyed, bro.

I never mentioned/used that in this discussion, so why the fuck bring it up?

Of course it's a belief. The difference between your belief and my own is that mine is based on the scientific discoveries of the brain, while yours is based on personal incredulity.

It seems to me from your reaction that "reincarnation" is your sacred cow. It's like you'll defend it as hard as you can and never let go of it no matter what.

Was not supposed to sound like I am offended, it was just a word of description, since that it's how it is all over the world. Even if they're not burned on a stake, a religious person in a atheistic community is usually persecuted now days, just like it was the opposite 500 years ago or so. Besides, I do not consider myself religious.

That is indeed true, but it is also beside the point.

I mentioned it because you argue about this in the same way as you did about God and ghosts.

What you say only reaches to the "death" part of dying, it is what happens afterwards that is interesting. These scientific discoveries can only explain what happens until the moment of death, something I can think out with my ass. What happens afterwards? Get to the problem instead of stopping halfway.



I have not even tried to defend my belief at all, I'm just trying to say that just like everyone else, you are saying that your belief is the truth, just because you and many other believe it is. There is a saying about democracy that goes "The majority is always right, even though the majority is usually wrong." that I think fits here. And by saying "sacred cow" I get the suspicion that you draw to much parallels to Hinduism, which is nothing like what I believe.

Please show where I say that my belief is the TRUTH.


Please show where I use the argument from popularity


Sacred Cow is used as a metaphor to describe someone's very cherished beliefs. No religious meaning attached.


HA! We're done here.

What, so you don't think that your belief is the truth? And also, linking me to this falacious reasoning site does also say something; you think I arrived to my belief because of ignorance of the obvious truth which is false.
I did it because I find it Most Likely and because there is no logical truth that would make it any less likely.


Ok, then w/e. "Very cherished belief?" -_-' My beliefs are never set in stone though.



Yea, since you ignored the only important part of my post that actually touches the subject of what happens after death, which is what this thread is all about. That is why I said that it is beside the point.

What happens then? MOAR NOTHING. Its like being brain-dead forever, you can't see, feel, or hear anything, no memories and no thought, that kind of nothing. How is that not an explanation? And what about imagination? I can imagine that, after death, I will wake up with my brain hooked up to a computer and I would realize that life was just a simulation crafted by our reptilian overlords, but thats what it all is, my imagination on crack.



Disturbing is subjective, but whatever. And I use the soul the way its commonly used by religious folk, as in a vessel for the conscious being.



Except consciousness is not matter, its a function of the brain that can only continue to exist if the brain is healthy and well tended to, which is sadly difficult to do when your rotting in the ground.



I never said it was the truth. I'm simply implying that I would rather believe that my country is an economic sh*t-hole than to believe that its the "bestest country evrar", because there is sufficient evidence to the former. And to me it IS horrifying, because there is not such thing as a "fate worse than death".



Its called skepticism, if you have enough evidence to prove that X exists/is the truth/has cake, then I would openly believe that it exists/acknowledge it to be truthful/eat x's cake.

Also, I want to learn more about your brand of reincarnation. If its not souls, then what is it that is passed on from body to body? Where did all these conscious beings come from? What happens if there is no new body to transfer to? Is there a set number of conscious beings, and if so what happens if there are too many bodies and not enough beings? What are the traits required to house these beings, is it all organic creatures from birds to bacteria, or just the ones capable of self-awareness?