what do you think of the recent change from 8bit to 10 bit?
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This thread doesn't explain the 10bit encodes at all.
I did some searching and found this:
http://figmentos.iblogger.org/10bit-encoding/
Excellent explanation, and shows exactly why it is so useful and needed. Also tells you which few rare programs work with it.
I did some searching and found this:
http://figmentos.iblogger.org/10bit-encoding/
Excellent explanation, and shows exactly why it is so useful and needed. Also tells you which few rare programs work with it.
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-Are the changes needed?
I'd say yes. HD vids take up a lot of space if it's 8bit encoding. With 10bit they can reduce the size to nearly half of the original size while retaining the quality.
-What should people who wants 8bit releases do?
CCCP, MPlayer 2.
-What should fansubbing groups do for those people?
CCCP, Mplayer 2. VLC isn't a choice.
-Which one do you prefer, 8bit or 10bit?
10bit, saves a shitload of space.
I'd say yes. HD vids take up a lot of space if it's 8bit encoding. With 10bit they can reduce the size to nearly half of the original size while retaining the quality.
-What should people who wants 8bit releases do?
CCCP, MPlayer 2.
-What should fansubbing groups do for those people?
CCCP, Mplayer 2. VLC isn't a choice.
-Which one do you prefer, 8bit or 10bit?
10bit, saves a shitload of space.
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-Are the changes needed?
small size + better quality= win
-What should people who wants 8bit releases do?
work to get better hardware or download and convert the videos themselves
-What should fansubbing groups do for those people?
only if they want/have enough spare time should release an 8-bit release alongside with the 10-bit one
-Which one do you prefer, 8bit or 10bit?
well for the moment i don't have any problem playing 10-bit if it's in HD/720p and it might stutter a little in fast moving scenes if the res is FULL HD/1080p because my cpu(amd 5000+) is being used 100% in those scenes; and i still haven't figured out how to make CoreAvc to work while playing 10-bit but strangely enough it works fine with all the other formats :O but i'm currently working so i hope to get a new pc after a few months so it won't be an issue at all :P
SO I'M ALL FOR 10-bit!!! since i'm currently on an anime downloading spree and i only have 1tb left of free space :P
small size + better quality= win
-What should people who wants 8bit releases do?
work to get better hardware or download and convert the videos themselves
-What should fansubbing groups do for those people?
only if they want/have enough spare time should release an 8-bit release alongside with the 10-bit one
-Which one do you prefer, 8bit or 10bit?
well for the moment i don't have any problem playing 10-bit if it's in HD/720p and it might stutter a little in fast moving scenes if the res is FULL HD/1080p because my cpu(amd 5000+) is being used 100% in those scenes; and i still haven't figured out how to make CoreAvc to work while playing 10-bit but strangely enough it works fine with all the other formats :O but i'm currently working so i hope to get a new pc after a few months so it won't be an issue at all :P
SO I'M ALL FOR 10-bit!!! since i'm currently on an anime downloading spree and i only have 1tb left of free space :P
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1. If the translators say yes, then that means yes.
2. Again, if the translators do not wish to release the 8-bit version, what can you do? Boycotting them by not downloading their stuffs? I think not.
3. Fansubs can do whatever they want. They translate all those things for WITHOUT getting paid, and people still want more? Start paying them then.
4. Whatever the releases are.
2. Again, if the translators do not wish to release the 8-bit version, what can you do? Boycotting them by not downloading their stuffs? I think not.
3. Fansubs can do whatever they want. They translate all those things for WITHOUT getting paid, and people still want more? Start paying them then.
4. Whatever the releases are.
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animefreak_usa
Child of Samael
I only notice that a good portion of the files size are smaller then 8bit.. but even the 10 bit is larger then before.. 440mb for 25 MIN EP IN 264+ MVK WITH 5.1.. seem bigger the the other of the same variety in 8-bit three months ago.
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Seem that most fansubs increase their raw quality when they use 10bit, thats why the file size seems the same as 8bit.
The file size are better though, the lost are random between 30-100mb depending the quality.
However, I read somewhere that CCCP also seems dont play the file as a 10bit (forgot where I read it), it simply reread the file as 8bit thats why it so hard for me to see the difference.
The file size are better though, the lost are random between 30-100mb depending the quality.
However, I read somewhere that CCCP also seems dont play the file as a 10bit (forgot where I read it), it simply reread the file as 8bit thats why it so hard for me to see the difference.
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CGrascal
Infamous
As someone who doesn't give a crap about video quality or pretty looking subs, I find this move to 10 bit pointless and unnecessary. And with players supposedly having trouble running videos in that format, it comes off as being idiotic to force users to run around trying this and that to get a video to run.
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Ripped straight from http://haruhichan.com/wpblog/?p=205.
Pros of Hi10P:
Significantly higher compression ratios resulting in vastly decreased file sizes. The first rounds of testing show a 20-40% improvement on file sizes
Far more information is preserved from the original, removing such issues as banding and poor detail in dark scenes
The encoder will have less things to worry about
Cons:
Slower decoding and encoding
No support for DXVA or CUDA as of writing
Slight compatibility issues when using obscure, obsolete devices like the PS3 to play back movies — but who does that, really?
I'd say 10bit is worth it alone for the smaller file sizes and better visual quality, especially debanding being a very good advantage. Here's an example (theoretical, but there are actual 8 bit vs. 10 bit comparisons out there; just can't seem to find the link right now):
8bit
10bit
The differences are subtle (look at his red shirt and the banding on it), but if it's better visuals at a lower file size, I'm all over it. And, as for people complaining about it stuttering or lagging, then it's about time for an upgrade (although there are cases where CPU usage seems to shoot up dramatically even on high end machines; I currently think that's a codec problem or a combination of codecs interfering with each other and not the machine itself).
Pros of Hi10P:
Significantly higher compression ratios resulting in vastly decreased file sizes. The first rounds of testing show a 20-40% improvement on file sizes
Far more information is preserved from the original, removing such issues as banding and poor detail in dark scenes
The encoder will have less things to worry about
Cons:
Slower decoding and encoding
No support for DXVA or CUDA as of writing
Slight compatibility issues when using obscure, obsolete devices like the PS3 to play back movies — but who does that, really?
I'd say 10bit is worth it alone for the smaller file sizes and better visual quality, especially debanding being a very good advantage. Here's an example (theoretical, but there are actual 8 bit vs. 10 bit comparisons out there; just can't seem to find the link right now):
8bit
10bit
The differences are subtle (look at his red shirt and the banding on it), but if it's better visuals at a lower file size, I'm all over it. And, as for people complaining about it stuttering or lagging, then it's about time for an upgrade (although there are cases where CPU usage seems to shoot up dramatically even on high end machines; I currently think that's a codec problem or a combination of codecs interfering with each other and not the machine itself).
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Cinia Pacifica
Ojou-sama Writer
-Did the changes are needed?
No, but its their decision.
-what should people who wants 8bit release do?
I don't know, maybe their PC are older and don't good hardware to play higher quality videos? I've seen a lot of hate 10 bit, though. It could be more than that.
-what should fansubs do for those people?
Nothing, they do what they want to.
-which one that you prefer, 8 bit or 10 bit?
10 Bit, the first video I watched with 10 bit encoding was Fate/Zero, it was so damn awesome.
No, but its their decision.
-what should people who wants 8bit release do?
I don't know, maybe their PC are older and don't good hardware to play higher quality videos? I've seen a lot of hate 10 bit, though. It could be more than that.
-what should fansubs do for those people?
Nothing, they do what they want to.
-which one that you prefer, 8 bit or 10 bit?
10 Bit, the first video I watched with 10 bit encoding was Fate/Zero, it was so damn awesome.
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animefreak_usa
Child of Samael
Update your cccp people.. also if you don't have a dual core or better... pray and close all programing.
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PotPlayer plays 10bit very well and you don't need to install CCCP. I dislike CCCP for the simple fact no player seems to use the filter automatically. PotPlayer has a interface like windows media player / kmplayer and works :)
Far as quality etc goes I don't notice a difference either way, only difference I noticed is I had to screw around with software to make a release work.
Far as quality etc goes I don't notice a difference either way, only difference I noticed is I had to screw around with software to make a release work.
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may i ask what are the diferences bettwen 8-bit and 10-bit? what does it refer to? how can i know if a certain file is encoded on 8-bit or 10-bit?
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animefreak_usa
Child of Samael
8-bit codecs describe each of these channels (red, green, and blue) using 8 bits of information, or about 255 different possible values. Incidentally, this is the same as "24-bit" color ("True" color) when we're talking about computer displays or photography -- and it's a good balance between picture quality and the amount of data needed to describe the video.
But 10-bit codecs spend an extra 2 bits of data per channel. If you're working uncompressed, then yes, that does correspond to roughly a 20% increase in filesize. But in exchange, you get 4 times as many levels of color for each color channel -- and this is a huge benefit as you're editing and mastering your video, even if you'll ultimately be using an 8-bit codec like MPEG-2 for output.
But 10-bit codecs spend an extra 2 bits of data per channel. If you're working uncompressed, then yes, that does correspond to roughly a 20% increase in filesize. But in exchange, you get 4 times as many levels of color for each color channel -- and this is a huge benefit as you're editing and mastering your video, even if you'll ultimately be using an 8-bit codec like MPEG-2 for output.
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i think is pointless... im watching the recently downloaded 10-bit witches and tentacles... well "trying to" is more acurate coz it plays but there are weird color disruptions every 5 or so secs like if my tv was taking bad air signal... is the people cant play your files theres no point of using a tecnology is my take on this one.
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Kaimax
Best Master-San
MarcosMora wrote...
i think is pointless... im watching the recently downloaded 10-bit witches and tentacles... well "trying to" is more acurate coz it plays but there are weird color disruptions every 5 or so secs like if my tv was taking bad air signal... is the people cant play your files theres no point of using a tecnology is my take on this one.It's actually very very VERY easy to upgrade your video player, the only problem is when you have an VERY outdated PC.
Once again the main reason why they changed to 10 bit = File size are way smaller.
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animefreak_usa
Child of Samael
File size is only 20-30mb less.
Colors are just a touch more vivid.
CPU is drained on faster frame rate scenes. even with dual and quad core processors.
Post processing into mp4/320x240 avc is impossible without converting into 8bit then post process... psp/icrap.
But when it all on a 50inch lcd screen... fucking beautiful.
Colors are just a touch more vivid.
CPU is drained on faster frame rate scenes. even with dual and quad core processors.
Post processing into mp4/320x240 avc is impossible without converting into 8bit then post process... psp/icrap.
But when it all on a 50inch lcd screen... fucking beautiful.
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well i liked the changes less data used up for a better quality. very nice. not to hard to make MPC play 10 bit either.
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no. im using Ubuntu. tried many players: VLC, totem, umplayer, banshee, and even mplayer2. but all of then show color blur on the video. also did a little resear on 10bit encoding, hardware aceleration is still not suported (aka using your video card to render) this means all the load goes to the cpu, this rise the entry bar for people with lower machines, not only "older" but entry level newer too, coz takes your video card as non-existant. I think the tecnology is still too raw to use it, and the drawbacks surprass the benefits. My suggestion is you go back to 8-bit until 10-bit become mainstream support. wich should happen in a year been pessimist.
