Dishonesty, do you still practice it?

It depends on the size of the text, and the size of a page.

It's like 12,000+ lines though.

Both the questions are open to interpretation based on the social context. In the standard context of the question 'How are you?', it is generally meant as a meaningless conversation starter, although in more intimate circumstances, it can be a genuine interest in the others well being.

Generally, if you were asking someone how many pages the Odyssey has, the person would have a copy on hand, or you knew they had been reading a copy. But the question could also be used in a rhetoric strategy, or to elicit a logic response, like my first line.

Ultimately, I don't think you can blame someone for misinterpreting the meaning of your question, but equally you can't always blame the person asking the question, because people generally (unless in a very delicate situation) don't think about how another person could interpret their words.

No, I'm sorry but you're wrong. Like before, there are two levels of discussion. This time there is the conceptual level and the contextual level. Both are Philosophy, the difference is that in former we appeal to common sense and practical reasoning. And that is what we are doing since that is what the original post talked about, it talked about day to day professional interactions.

Your distinction about social or intimate conversations is a waste, as I've already pointed it out. Not trying to sound mean but I just can't discard it otherwise it would seem as if it's a counter argument.

The example of the Odyssey isn't great because I was looking at my version and wrote it down. I just wanted an example of a simple question. It should be: «How many pages does this book have?» There's no debate there. I mean, there is if you want to be a skeptic toward the external world and the existence of numbers and all that but again, conceptual versus contextual discussion.

With regards to the final paragraph, yes, misunderstandings exist but, for lack of better term, let's cut the crap.

There is a large difference between «how are you?» and «how are you?». In writing maybe not but imagine the first is one of your best friends asking after not seeing you for three months and the second is the guy you saw yesterday at the bus stop.

Your interpretations make sense, again, in a contextual sense. If it was a logic textbook, yes, we'd have to be very clear as to what the question means. But what we are talking about is random interactions with random people.

~

I might as well take this chance to point out that after writing that post, I got 18 negative votes on old comments. Really ought to show how, first, the comment rating system is broken and pointless and, second, how ecchigaijin is a complete moron who seems to disagree with things only because I say them and can't manage to stand his ground.

No need to apologize if you think I'm wrong.

And my point was entirely that almost all questions can be misinterpretted. Which means ecchigaijin was technically right, that asking "how are you?" can, if the other person misreads it, open you up for them dumping their life story on you. And unlike misinterpretting "how many pages does the Odyssey have?", it can be quite awkward to stop someone in the middle of talking about their problems to point out you didn't really want to know. However, I think stopping using the question "how are you?" is a bit of an overreaction (unless you know a specific person is likely to misinterpret it).

But if we are ignoring misinterprettations, then I'll agree with you.

And I also have recieved downvotes on old comments, and by the looks of it, it seems someone has gone through some serious discussion topics and downvoted all the comments. But it's not like forum rep is that important anyway.
And are you claiming that ecchigaijin is the one responsible? If you are then that seems like a rather rash assumption.

My point wasn't that they can't be misinterpreted, my point was basically, although I didn't come right and say it, that if a «semi-stranger» asks «how are you?» you should understand the social context and reply accordingly regardless of any particular recent events. In other words, we should be self-aware and thus, we should not be idiots. Being «real» is important here. It goes back to the induction argument. From a reasoned, technical, logical view, it stands. From a real, practical view, it fails.

Claim is a strong word. It seems to imply I either have prove and/or will take legal action lol I'm just pretty sure it's him since we have a bit of a history I wish I could take back.

I've stopped caring about forum reputation either, I just think it is a terrible system because it is always used by sissies who can't put two words together so they just downvote as if to say «You're wrong, I'm better than you but I don't wanna say why. Also, my dad could beat up your dad».

I know that was your point. And I agree with it, but I'm just saying you have to be aware that some people are pretty bad at reading social context. Granted for most interactions you won't be thinking that, but if you think the person is likely to misinterpret you, either from your own experience or secondary data, then it may be something you should consider.



I won't pry into what's between you, but I don't think it's him because his comments seem to have also been downvoted. Unless he purposefully did it to himself to avoid suspicion.

I guess for me that I get the lable, "too honest for your own good". I am usually honest about things (and if I am not, my emotions will say it for me). Yet I'm human like everyone so I am not always honest and have been dishonest before.

Even though I admit to being dishonest sometimes, I don't make a point on practing it. I never saw the point in lying about most things. The times I have lied, I was either terrible at it (always have been) and it never did me any good.

Lying, trust and respect all go hand-in-hand with one another. If you lie about things too much then you seem untrustworthy and in-turn you can loose respect for that person. I remember one of my ex's use to lie to me quite a bit and over useless things. I remember talking with him over it and he said that he felt I would get mad over the truth.... This made no sense to me because I was more upset that he had to lie to me. I felt like we had no trust in our relationship (it died soon after that).

The only lies I find acceptable are one's that you use when you are planning something nice for the other person (celebrations or gifts). Just be careful about how you fib with this though, since I've known some people to take it too far and upset the other person.

Okay, trust I agree with, but not respect. At least not in my mind. If you value honesty highly, then it would certainly influence your respect for them. But their are many people who it is easy to respect even if they are untrustworthy. For instance, I respect Light Yagami because he is intelligent, cunning and is capable of holding face in very difficult social scenarios (even if he was a sore loser). But he lied to pretty much everyone he knew.

And to be honest, if someone isn't comfortable telling someone the truth over insignificant things because they don't want to deal with that person being mad at them, they probably shouldn't be considering going out with them. I can totally understand that being a problem in a relationship.

However, if the person was lying about it because they didn't want it to lessen my opinion of them, it would be a different matter. I would not be mad at them, in fact I would be flattered that they valued my opinion of them that much. But then, maybe my view is influenced by how few deep emotional connections I've had in my life, causing me to value someone who cares for me higher then I normally would.

I see your point and your right mine is how I was raised and my own personality.

I don’t condemn people who lie to me and I won’t think they are a terrible person. I realize most people don’t feel comfortable talking about the truth, especially when you are just getting to know a person. I wouldn’t expect people to be as honest with me as I am them (sometimes I wish I was better at lying lol). I can forgive some lies, I just don’t enjoy when I feel like everything about a person is a lie or they have it in their head that they have to lie to me for whatever reason.

I’ll initially react to a lie in some way, but after some time I try to see the bigger picture and then I will make my own judgments from there. I just make it clear that with my personality, that honesty is something I like to give to others and that I enjoy when they do the same. If a person doesn’t see things this way, I can still be friends with them or talk with them, just won’t be close or anything.

I would say I do practice lying. Personally I think it makes life a bit more interesting. It may just be me but when you're small talking with friends or strangers at a party, you kinda do expect a bit of exaggeration or altercation in their stories.

I wouldn't say I'm a skilled liar, I don't make it to be convincing in all my lies and I understand the boundaries that shouldn't be crossed. Lying was a method of protection for me though. Back in my high school days, there were people who'd try to exploit you if they saw you were an honest or naive sort so bluffing or putting on airs was a way I cleared from them. I say it was because it's actually become less and less necessary for me to use it in this manner.

Nowadays I just use it for entertainment. Talking to friends, if they jokingly insinuated something about me, well I wasn't one to dash their hopes away.

Besides, just because you don't lie doesn't mean others won't. Being a liar yourself helps you catch one.

I can understand the protection mechanism through high school. My personal adaptation was becoming someone who gave off negative vibes (the fact that I was and still am a large guy probably helped too). Most people ended up steering clear of me, and I don't blame them, either. I already had my core friends, so I didn't really desire anymore people sticking their nose in my business and life.

As with anything through life, you get better at lying the more you practise it. But some have a natural talent for such things.

For the rare times I use bigger lies, I have the habit of losing interest in maintaining them. So I forget important details that pull the lie apart.


I myself only use white lies nowadays, mostly when I'm too polite to just say "no" to something and I make an excuse/illness up. If it was something my friends arranged to do, I later reveal it was a lie and we just have a giggle about it because I'm now notorious for having the shits at a moment's notice.

I am a master liar, always have been since like middle school. It just comes natural to make up very believable circumstances, facial expressions, wording, emotions, all that. But I don't lie to family or friends or anything.

I rarely lie, but I am a magnificent liar if I try.

I lie when I need to or feel like it. I lie to avoid fights with family and friends and to make others feel better (by-the-book-example: "You're looking good with that new haircut"). It's really not hard, just try to hold the feeling of laughter in. ;)

I'm good at lying or so I think. People don't question me when I say something dishonest. I prefer honesty and usually just speak my what is on my mind.. Also I prefer when people around me are honest. I still find myself hiding things when I speak to people, but I don't consider this lying or dishonest. I think more of it as not wanting to show everything or open up.