The Dilema: Am I Overreacting, Or Is She Too Aloof?
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So basically I am in a budding relationship. It's only been a couple of months. Not really able to call her (let's call her Adriana) my girlfriend (nor is she able to call me her boyfriend), but we are committed to one another in the sense that we won't look about for anyone else. I'm a virgin to everything romantic, this being my first relationship (20) and her third (21).
Also: Long Distance Relationship. I'm NY, she's Florida
I used to come to my best friend (Let's call her Nell) for advice and help, but she happens to be her best friend too, and I want to be the kind of friend my best friend Nell deserves. I don't want to drag her into any of my worries, so, I come to the community of my favorite porn site. ...Kind of silly sounding in retrospect, but I have hopes.
Two issues. Both are pretty big.
The first: Adriana has had bad relationships in the past. Two to be exact. She's told me from the get go that she's complicated and she hopes I'll understand the time it will take her to open up to me. At first she was unbelievably snuggly and affectionate, but after I apparently reacted with too much affection (smothering. Happens with virgins in romance, I know. Still wish I hadn't) she's become...less affectionate. She's a quiet person at heart apparently, but still...
-For example, she started sending me hearts <3, but I soon found out she didn't send one back when I sent her one. She'd only send me a heart "when I feel like it". I brought this up recently and she told me that those little <3 didn't have any affection to them. In fact, they were stuffing, as she said, "I just send them whenever for lots of things. You're just reading too much into it."
Yeah, I know, <3 is the smallest complaint you could think of, but that's how it is. No hugs, no sweet sentiments, barely anything and despite this being long distance she doesn't like going into a voice chat let alone a video chat. Just IM all the time. Hell, I forget the sound of her voice once in while! (not that I've brought this whole thing to her. Just the hearts) The only reason I know this is even a relationship at all is because she had once made an outfit of my favorite character and sent me a picture of herself in it. After that...nothing. I tell her sweet sentiments occasionally and though I don't give her random hugs (in an effort not to be smothering) I do send her hearts. Though I'm thinking about changing that...
Opinions?
The second problem is that she lets guys flirt with her. To make this brief, she doesn't care if a girl or three flirt with me, and she doesn't consider flirting offensive or harmful. I don't flirt and I make sure to tell flirting girls I'm not interested. I get meaner with the persistent ones and just tell them to cut it out and go away because I'm in a relationship. Adriana doesn't do the same. To her, if they flirt with her for a long time without touching her then it's fine. I told her how I felt about that, and she was pretty much "I don't get it. There's nothing wrong with it."
_Worse yet is that the recent example that started this was a guy she'd known years ago (I think they dated a while but nothing happened, he turned out to be the opposite of what she wanted or something) who was flirting with her at a party. I asked her if she told him to back off and told him she was in a relationship already, but she kept avoiding the question. "He's in an open relationship. It doesn't matter to him." "I know how he works. I just let it go until he finds some other girl to flirt with." "I didn't see it as offensive at all."
*scratches head* She told me he was a "dangerous type". I was about ready to take a damn flight ASAP until she clarified that he was the kind of dangerous that can woo a girl into his pants with a smile. Why would she let someone like that, someone she has a bad history with, flirt with her for even a minute? If it's a question of her needing to be told she's pretty once in a while then that's null and void because I do. Not to the extent I first did (smothering of course), but I do when it's asked or on a random occasion I'll tell her how beautiful her body and her mind is to me.
When I brought all of this (second problem) up to her and told her my feelings on it and said, "I understand you don't see a problem in it, Adriana, but it matters to me. I'm as devoted to this relationship as you are, and it bothers me when you let a guy flirt with you. So, please don't let anybody do that to you."
She went offline for a nap, came back, and we didn't talk about it again. I don't know if she ignored my words, or if she understood them and just didn't have anything to say. I would bring this up to her, but I don't want her to think I'm being possessive (a problem she had with a douche a long time ago).
Opinions?
And that's everything that bothers me. Am I overreacting, or is she too aloof? Does she not take this seriously like I do, or am I still acting a little smothery?
-If you think "tl;dr" then don't respond. Period. If you don't have the time to read/skim then you don't have the time to reply. If you don't want to read, then don't bother leaving a reply telling me I typed too much. I would however truly appreciate a real response.
EDIT: My mother almost died. Asthma. Though she was stable afterward, I was still shaken up. You know, after effects. I tell Adriana this in an IM (because, as previously said that's all we ever do) hoping for a comforting word, something like what she would do when we were just new friends. "D: Oh no! Is she okay? Try not to stress too much, alright? It's okay to be nervous."
Her response was basically: "I think anything I say will come out as hollow no matter how you tell me even a single comforting word from me, despite it sounding "cliche", means to you. Quote: You've come to the wrong person to lean on".
...So yeah. It's one thing to be distant, it's another to be so distant you don't even attempt to console your.. Problem is worse in my eyes now.
Still would appreciate opinions.
[Thank you to those who've given their opinions already. Your support is so seriously welcome, as was your well-spoken honesty. When I can, I'll +rep all of you for being so considerate and not being trolls. Thank you so much.]
Also: Long Distance Relationship. I'm NY, she's Florida
I used to come to my best friend (Let's call her Nell) for advice and help, but she happens to be her best friend too, and I want to be the kind of friend my best friend Nell deserves. I don't want to drag her into any of my worries, so, I come to the community of my favorite porn site. ...Kind of silly sounding in retrospect, but I have hopes.
Two issues. Both are pretty big.
The first: Adriana has had bad relationships in the past. Two to be exact. She's told me from the get go that she's complicated and she hopes I'll understand the time it will take her to open up to me. At first she was unbelievably snuggly and affectionate, but after I apparently reacted with too much affection (smothering. Happens with virgins in romance, I know. Still wish I hadn't) she's become...less affectionate. She's a quiet person at heart apparently, but still...
-For example, she started sending me hearts <3, but I soon found out she didn't send one back when I sent her one. She'd only send me a heart "when I feel like it". I brought this up recently and she told me that those little <3 didn't have any affection to them. In fact, they were stuffing, as she said, "I just send them whenever for lots of things. You're just reading too much into it."
Yeah, I know, <3 is the smallest complaint you could think of, but that's how it is. No hugs, no sweet sentiments, barely anything and despite this being long distance she doesn't like going into a voice chat let alone a video chat. Just IM all the time. Hell, I forget the sound of her voice once in while! (not that I've brought this whole thing to her. Just the hearts) The only reason I know this is even a relationship at all is because she had once made an outfit of my favorite character and sent me a picture of herself in it. After that...nothing. I tell her sweet sentiments occasionally and though I don't give her random hugs (in an effort not to be smothering) I do send her hearts. Though I'm thinking about changing that...
Opinions?
The second problem is that she lets guys flirt with her. To make this brief, she doesn't care if a girl or three flirt with me, and she doesn't consider flirting offensive or harmful. I don't flirt and I make sure to tell flirting girls I'm not interested. I get meaner with the persistent ones and just tell them to cut it out and go away because I'm in a relationship. Adriana doesn't do the same. To her, if they flirt with her for a long time without touching her then it's fine. I told her how I felt about that, and she was pretty much "I don't get it. There's nothing wrong with it."
_Worse yet is that the recent example that started this was a guy she'd known years ago (I think they dated a while but nothing happened, he turned out to be the opposite of what she wanted or something) who was flirting with her at a party. I asked her if she told him to back off and told him she was in a relationship already, but she kept avoiding the question. "He's in an open relationship. It doesn't matter to him." "I know how he works. I just let it go until he finds some other girl to flirt with." "I didn't see it as offensive at all."
*scratches head* She told me he was a "dangerous type". I was about ready to take a damn flight ASAP until she clarified that he was the kind of dangerous that can woo a girl into his pants with a smile. Why would she let someone like that, someone she has a bad history with, flirt with her for even a minute? If it's a question of her needing to be told she's pretty once in a while then that's null and void because I do. Not to the extent I first did (smothering of course), but I do when it's asked or on a random occasion I'll tell her how beautiful her body and her mind is to me.
When I brought all of this (second problem) up to her and told her my feelings on it and said, "I understand you don't see a problem in it, Adriana, but it matters to me. I'm as devoted to this relationship as you are, and it bothers me when you let a guy flirt with you. So, please don't let anybody do that to you."
She went offline for a nap, came back, and we didn't talk about it again. I don't know if she ignored my words, or if she understood them and just didn't have anything to say. I would bring this up to her, but I don't want her to think I'm being possessive (a problem she had with a douche a long time ago).
Opinions?
And that's everything that bothers me. Am I overreacting, or is she too aloof? Does she not take this seriously like I do, or am I still acting a little smothery?
-If you think "tl;dr" then don't respond. Period. If you don't have the time to read/skim then you don't have the time to reply. If you don't want to read, then don't bother leaving a reply telling me I typed too much. I would however truly appreciate a real response.
EDIT: My mother almost died. Asthma. Though she was stable afterward, I was still shaken up. You know, after effects. I tell Adriana this in an IM (because, as previously said that's all we ever do) hoping for a comforting word, something like what she would do when we were just new friends. "D: Oh no! Is she okay? Try not to stress too much, alright? It's okay to be nervous."
Her response was basically: "I think anything I say will come out as hollow no matter how you tell me even a single comforting word from me, despite it sounding "cliche", means to you. Quote: You've come to the wrong person to lean on".
...So yeah. It's one thing to be distant, it's another to be so distant you don't even attempt to console your.. Problem is worse in my eyes now.
Still would appreciate opinions.
[Thank you to those who've given their opinions already. Your support is so seriously welcome, as was your well-spoken honesty. When I can, I'll +rep all of you for being so considerate and not being trolls. Thank you so much.]
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well.. those 2 problems you thought are the biggest problem is not the main root of the problem i guess.. yes, i read them..
from what i see, the biggest problems here are
1. This is your first
2. Long Distance Relationship
I don't trust Long distance relationship, been there and it's suck!
now i tried to answer your question
1. you are expecting too much, giving <3 doesn't mean anything
2. well, that's just the way she is i guess.. and no! you are not overreacting.. if you bring this up again, i predict there will be a fight.. girls like these are quite stubborn.. (i've met these kinda girl)
from what i see, the biggest problems here are
1. This is your first
2. Long Distance Relationship
I don't trust Long distance relationship, been there and it's suck!
now i tried to answer your question
1. you are expecting too much, giving <3 doesn't mean anything
2. well, that's just the way she is i guess.. and no! you are not overreacting.. if you bring this up again, i predict there will be a fight.. girls like these are quite stubborn.. (i've met these kinda girl)
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bletok wrote...
*SNIP*now i tried to answer your question
1. you are expecting too much, giving <3 doesn't mean anything
2. well, that's just the way she is i guess.. and no! you are not overreacting..
Thank you very much, bletok. Thank you for your honesty about long distance relationships without being a douche about them too. <3 is just a <3. But the other thing...
_Anyway, thank you for taking your time. I'm still open to others' opinions, but whether more respond or don't, I truly appreciate it.
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Takerial
Lovable Teddy Bear
Long Distance Relationships do not mean they will fail.
But they are definitely harder to make work than In Person Relationships. And it takes both of you making the effort for the chance of it working to even be possible.
Honestly, from the way it sounds. She's just in a relationship with you to be in a relationship.
Most girls, while still be a bit flirty at times as they do like to feel attractive, will not allow a guy to flirt too much if they feel they are in a serious relationship.
Even if that isn't a case, the fact that she isn't taking your discomfort seriously is still a pretty big problem regardless if it isn't being worked through.
The first problem isn't necessarily a big deal. It actually happens frequently in Long Distance Relationship, even healthy ones. The cause of it could be different though.
One potential is that she just feels like it's a chore more than a relationship. Which would support the second problem.
Another less serious one would be that, which this often happens, she is feeling that this type of contact just isn't cutting it for a real relationship. This is why Long Distant Relationship are so difficult. Because you start wanting to be able to touch and feel each other and have that physical intimacy and closeness that you can't have.
Of course a couple of months or so is usually not long enough for this to occur.
So yeah. My personal opinion. She's in a relationship with you to be in a relationship.
But they are definitely harder to make work than In Person Relationships. And it takes both of you making the effort for the chance of it working to even be possible.
Honestly, from the way it sounds. She's just in a relationship with you to be in a relationship.
Most girls, while still be a bit flirty at times as they do like to feel attractive, will not allow a guy to flirt too much if they feel they are in a serious relationship.
Even if that isn't a case, the fact that she isn't taking your discomfort seriously is still a pretty big problem regardless if it isn't being worked through.
The first problem isn't necessarily a big deal. It actually happens frequently in Long Distance Relationship, even healthy ones. The cause of it could be different though.
One potential is that she just feels like it's a chore more than a relationship. Which would support the second problem.
Another less serious one would be that, which this often happens, she is feeling that this type of contact just isn't cutting it for a real relationship. This is why Long Distant Relationship are so difficult. Because you start wanting to be able to touch and feel each other and have that physical intimacy and closeness that you can't have.
Of course a couple of months or so is usually not long enough for this to occur.
So yeah. My personal opinion. She's in a relationship with you to be in a relationship.
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Kalistean wrote...
Long Distance Relationships do not mean they will fail.*SNIP*
Of course a couple of months or so is usually not long enough for this to occur.
So yeah. My personal opinion. She's in a relationship with you to be in a relationship.
That's what I'm afraid of...
Thank you very much, Kalistean for reading and responding the way you did. I really appreciate your opinion and how inoffensive (not offensive, sorry if you already knew that) you made it. I'm still open to more opinions, of course, but thank you for being honest without being cruel.
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Takerial
Lovable Teddy Bear
I'm not saying it's the case of course.
But it's the most likely reason I believe.
The only way to really know is to talk it out with her. Share some of the concerns you have.
Of course you want to be careful of how you phrase it. Because this sort of thing can quickly start to sound and be accusatory. One way to avoid this, is to try discussing smaller issues to feel it out and then work your way up.
If you want any chance of it being a real relationship, you need to have this type of talk with her. All real romantic relationships have to involve this in some way, or else they just won't work. Not necessarily this type of situation, but similar.
If she refuses to talk these things out, or brushes them aside every time. It means she doesn't want it to work out.
But it's the most likely reason I believe.
The only way to really know is to talk it out with her. Share some of the concerns you have.
Of course you want to be careful of how you phrase it. Because this sort of thing can quickly start to sound and be accusatory. One way to avoid this, is to try discussing smaller issues to feel it out and then work your way up.
If you want any chance of it being a real relationship, you need to have this type of talk with her. All real romantic relationships have to involve this in some way, or else they just won't work. Not necessarily this type of situation, but similar.
If she refuses to talk these things out, or brushes them aside every time. It means she doesn't want it to work out.
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THE FOLLOWING IS MY PERSONAL OPINION! TAKE IT AS SUCH!
First off, just let me say that she wasn't kidding when she said she was complicated.
For the first issue you brought up, I think you're being a little over-sensitive but not too much. The texting and IMing <3s thing is just a small symptom of what seems to be her overall problem with relationships. By itself it's not a big thing and you shouldn't look into it much. But as a small indicator of a bigger issue, it's upsetting. The "snuggly and affectionate" until you are bit is the real problem. It shows that she has intimacy issues, probably due to the overly possessive ex you mentioned. If you were together physically I'd caution you to take it slowly but, since you're in a LDR, it's kind of iffy that she's backing off even on an emotional / intellectual level.
To sum up, yes, those are indicators that she's not as into it as you are. No, you shouldn't take it as a sign that she'll never love you, but she's right... you're going to have to wait this one out and be patient with her.
The second issue is connected to the first in that she's technically with you but she doesn't see leaving her options open as a problem. You obviously do which means you're seeing more in this relationship than she is and, as soon as you try to tell her it's a problem, she backs away. I don't know enough about your situation to completely agree with Kalistean's assessment that she's with you just to be in a relationship just yet but she's certainly playing the game and it's clear that she's just not as committed to you as you are to her. If she were then your opinions would carry more weight.
She's clearly not compromising on how she behaves and has told you several times that she doesn't see a problem where you do. That's a hint to you that she's not letting you influence her behavior. She's emphasizing the fact that you two aren't REALLY boyfriend and girlfriend and that, even if you were, she wouldn't let you tell her what to do. That's not necessarily about you, but more about her and her reaction to her past relationships. It sounds to me like Possessive Ex liked to tell her what to do, what to feel, and when to do so and she's asserting her freedom before that kind of thing happens again.
Soooo, where does that leave you? Honestly, you're not in a position I'd envy. Your feelings are mixed up with a really complex girl who's trying her best not to get too involved with anyone. She cares enough for you to be affectionate with you and give you her attention but, whenever thing start getting too serious, she backs out of arm's reach again. It's less a problem with you and more an issue with her being unable, at the moment, to give the amount of emotion that you're wanting to receive from her. That doesn't necessarily mean that she never will but the possibility exists.
As for what you should do, that's up to you. You have to decide for yourself just how good for you her behavior is and how much you're willing to put up with. She's put you into a position of "accept me how I am or break up with me." If you love her and you want to be with her then you're going to have to be patiently persistent. Play the game by her rules on the outside but sneak in moments of abrupt romance / affection occasionally so that she still knows you want her and she doesn't get bored. She's sort of testing the waters with you to see if you're patient enough to stick with her until she's over her skittishness from her last few relationships. Is it fair to you? No. But she's made it plain as day that this is how it's going to be. You've tried to get her to be more attentive to your emotional wants and needs and her response has been "I don't find anything wrong with my behavior." It seems uncompromising but it's really just her defensive mechanism.
As I said before, I don't envy your position. She's a difficult girl who met you before she was really ready to be in a new relationship. If you want to be with her then, for now, you have to be patient and understanding. She clearly cares about you, so there's enough there to hope for more. There's no guarantee, though. So it's your choice... stick with her and hope she opens up to you more or break up and try to find someone else who's more understanding of your needs. Whatever you decide, good luck to you.
First off, just let me say that she wasn't kidding when she said she was complicated.
For the first issue you brought up, I think you're being a little over-sensitive but not too much. The texting and IMing <3s thing is just a small symptom of what seems to be her overall problem with relationships. By itself it's not a big thing and you shouldn't look into it much. But as a small indicator of a bigger issue, it's upsetting. The "snuggly and affectionate" until you are bit is the real problem. It shows that she has intimacy issues, probably due to the overly possessive ex you mentioned. If you were together physically I'd caution you to take it slowly but, since you're in a LDR, it's kind of iffy that she's backing off even on an emotional / intellectual level.
To sum up, yes, those are indicators that she's not as into it as you are. No, you shouldn't take it as a sign that she'll never love you, but she's right... you're going to have to wait this one out and be patient with her.
The second issue is connected to the first in that she's technically with you but she doesn't see leaving her options open as a problem. You obviously do which means you're seeing more in this relationship than she is and, as soon as you try to tell her it's a problem, she backs away. I don't know enough about your situation to completely agree with Kalistean's assessment that she's with you just to be in a relationship just yet but she's certainly playing the game and it's clear that she's just not as committed to you as you are to her. If she were then your opinions would carry more weight.
She's clearly not compromising on how she behaves and has told you several times that she doesn't see a problem where you do. That's a hint to you that she's not letting you influence her behavior. She's emphasizing the fact that you two aren't REALLY boyfriend and girlfriend and that, even if you were, she wouldn't let you tell her what to do. That's not necessarily about you, but more about her and her reaction to her past relationships. It sounds to me like Possessive Ex liked to tell her what to do, what to feel, and when to do so and she's asserting her freedom before that kind of thing happens again.
Soooo, where does that leave you? Honestly, you're not in a position I'd envy. Your feelings are mixed up with a really complex girl who's trying her best not to get too involved with anyone. She cares enough for you to be affectionate with you and give you her attention but, whenever thing start getting too serious, she backs out of arm's reach again. It's less a problem with you and more an issue with her being unable, at the moment, to give the amount of emotion that you're wanting to receive from her. That doesn't necessarily mean that she never will but the possibility exists.
As for what you should do, that's up to you. You have to decide for yourself just how good for you her behavior is and how much you're willing to put up with. She's put you into a position of "accept me how I am or break up with me." If you love her and you want to be with her then you're going to have to be patiently persistent. Play the game by her rules on the outside but sneak in moments of abrupt romance / affection occasionally so that she still knows you want her and she doesn't get bored. She's sort of testing the waters with you to see if you're patient enough to stick with her until she's over her skittishness from her last few relationships. Is it fair to you? No. But she's made it plain as day that this is how it's going to be. You've tried to get her to be more attentive to your emotional wants and needs and her response has been "I don't find anything wrong with my behavior." It seems uncompromising but it's really just her defensive mechanism.
As I said before, I don't envy your position. She's a difficult girl who met you before she was really ready to be in a new relationship. If you want to be with her then, for now, you have to be patient and understanding. She clearly cares about you, so there's enough there to hope for more. There's no guarantee, though. So it's your choice... stick with her and hope she opens up to you more or break up and try to find someone else who's more understanding of your needs. Whatever you decide, good luck to you.
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SunQuan wrote...
*SNIP*As I said before, I don't envy your position. She's a difficult girl who met you before she was really ready to be in a new relationship. If you want to be with her then, for now, you have to be patient and understanding. She clearly cares about you, so there's enough there to hope for more. There's no guarantee, though. So it's your choice... stick with her and hope she opens up to you more or break up and try to find someone else who's more understanding of your needs. Whatever you decide, good luck to you.
Thank you for putting so much thought and effort into this response. I appreciate you being so objective and honest. I don't know what to think.. I do want to be with her, but...
I'll give what you said some thought as I will the previous responses and if anymore responses come along. What you said...it gives me some room to see something. Thanks.
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Rep for SunQuan :)
Everything that SunQuan has posted, along with this:
Don't pursue the relationship if you're looking for love. At least, not if your wanted to be loved NOW. Like Sun said, it's going to take A WHILE, at the very least. That and being in a long distance relationship doesn't help much. Since your green on these kinds of things, I'd recommend that you don't cut contact with her, just don't expect much from her. Why? For the obvious reasons you mentioned before. Regardless of how much you may desire for her to be in a relationship with you, you must understand that she doesn't want to at the moment. She's had her own experiences, and it may be better for you to have some experiences of your own first. Perhaps with other inexperienced girl/women who have not had their fair share of love and such.
Just my opinion :)
Everything that SunQuan has posted, along with this:
Don't pursue the relationship if you're looking for love. At least, not if your wanted to be loved NOW. Like Sun said, it's going to take A WHILE, at the very least. That and being in a long distance relationship doesn't help much. Since your green on these kinds of things, I'd recommend that you don't cut contact with her, just don't expect much from her. Why? For the obvious reasons you mentioned before. Regardless of how much you may desire for her to be in a relationship with you, you must understand that she doesn't want to at the moment. She's had her own experiences, and it may be better for you to have some experiences of your own first. Perhaps with other inexperienced girl/women who have not had their fair share of love and such.
Just my opinion :)
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Long distance relationships mostly end badly. It sucks for you because this is your first relationship but this was probably a mistake, though also a learning experience. It sounds probably like she has lost interest in you because you can't be together and she may have someone else in mind. Relationships are all about proximity, and its probably unreasonable to expect her to be happy waiting around for you, even though you feel differently. I'm assuming you two can't close the distance between one another, so I'm going to say you should probably end the relationship.