Japanese Demons
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Most of the books on folklore that are free on Google books are incredibly outdated. Most date to before WWI, so they might not be entirely accurate or have some bias. Not sure though, there isn't anything more recent to compare it too. I think to learn anymore, you'd have to actually venture outside and visit a library.
Yes they have demons that are like say, Christianity's demons but not all of the "demons" are like that. They have things like Youkai which the closest thing you would find in western lore is Elves and the Fey.
The point is that they don't call them just demons. They have a variety of names for the various supernatural creatures, just like in western lore.
What this is doing would be the equivalent of taking angels, elves, and monsters from western lore, and just using just one umbrella term when being translated to describe all of them that means one specific thing in the language it's being translated in.
Except he didn't ask about any of those things. There are some benevolent characters in Japanese mythology or those that are not what you consider "demons". However, that isn't what he is interested in or what this thread is about. It is about what IS a demon in Japanese folklore - and there are in fact demons, evil spirits that do horrible things.
Kalistean wrote...
No, they call them something else. We just translate it as demon in an attempt to find something relevant.Yes they have demons that are like say, Christianity's demons but not all of the "demons" are like that. They have things like Youkai which the closest thing you would find in western lore is Elves and the Fey.
The point is that they don't call them just demons. They have a variety of names for the various supernatural creatures, just like in western lore.
What this is doing would be the equivalent of taking angels, elves, and monsters from western lore, and just using just one umbrella term when being translated to describe all of them that means one specific thing in the language it's being translated in.
Except he didn't ask about any of those things. There are some benevolent characters in Japanese mythology or those that are not what you consider "demons". However, that isn't what he is interested in or what this thread is about. It is about what IS a demon in Japanese folklore - and there are in fact demons, evil spirits that do horrible things.
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Takerial
Lovable Teddy Bear
neko-chan wrote...
Most of the books on folklore that are free on Google books are incredibly outdated. Most date to before WWI, so they might not be entirely accurate or have some bias. Not sure though, there isn't anything more recent to compare it too. I think to learn anymore, you'd have to actually venture outside and visit a library. Kalistean wrote...
No, they call them something else. We just translate it as demon in an attempt to find something relevant.Yes they have demons that are like say, Christianity's demons but not all of the "demons" are like that. They have things like Youkai which the closest thing you would find in western lore is Elves and the Fey.
The point is that they don't call them just demons. They have a variety of names for the various supernatural creatures, just like in western lore.
What this is doing would be the equivalent of taking angels, elves, and monsters from western lore, and just using just one umbrella term when being translated to describe all of them that means one specific thing in the language it's being translated in.
Except he didn't ask about any of those things. There are some benevolent characters in Japanese mythology or those that are not what you consider "demons". However, that isn't what he is interested in or what this thread is about. It is about what IS a demon in Japanese folklore - and there are in fact demons, evil spirits that do horrible things.
Except he does in fact include them within his topic of discussion. The key point being "I got interested because I saw them in Inuyasha."
Apparently you miss my point? That what he is asking about doesn't 'just' include hell type demons or along those lines. They branch out into things that are similar to Elves and the Fey in western lore.
Or do you not know that there are plenty of Elves and Fey that are considered evil spirits that do horrible things?
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shinji_ikari
Mustn't Run Away...
Sprite wrote...
Once again, Hinduism as over 330 million deities. No other religion can compare.In ancient times it was believed that there were 330 million living beings. This gave rise to the idea of 330 million deities or gods. Actually, this vast number of gods could not have been possibly worshiped, since 330 million names could not have been designed for them. The number 330 million was simply used to give a symbolic expression to the fundamental Hindu doctrine that God lives in the hearts of all living beings.
..so yeah...just stop repeating that shit
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Iam1vs100xp wrote...
This topic reminds me of Touhou.
[font=Verdana][color=green]Lol lol; that's the reason alone I'm not getting into Touhou ;]
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Kalistean wrote...
Spoiler:
Except he does in fact include them within his topic of discussion. The key point being "I got interested because I saw them in Inuyasha."
Apparently you miss my point? That what he is asking about doesn't 'just' include hell type demons or along those lines. They branch out into things that are similar to Elves and the Fey in western lore.
Or do you not know that there are plenty of Elves and Fey that are considered evil spirits that do horrible things?
The first and the last time I am responding to you.
I never said that I got interested in this topic by watching Inu Yasha, and I did explicitly state that I am intrigued with the Japanese demons because they are malicious!
I know that you are dumb, and that you won't stop spamming anyway. But please, keep me out of all the nonsense you write.
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First and foremost, I'll answer the topic, I find Japanese demons to be boring compared to the demons created by other culture. It's probably because of their Kappa. Who the fuck is scared of a bald turtle? Anyway there are some books that may help if you're really interested in this.
Here's a few:
Reading the literatures of Asian America by Lim, Shirley; Ling, Amy
A Field Guide to Demons, Fairies, Fallen Angels, and Other Subversive Spirits by Mack, Carol; Mack
Asian horror encyclopedia: Asian horror culture in literature, manga and folklore by Bush, Laurence C
etc etc
As for anime and mangas there's ofcourse Inuyasha, NURAHIYON NO MAGO, Spooky Keitaro (ewww), Ghost Hunt
As for everyone:
I'm disappointed honestly. When I read the topic I immediately understood that the guy is only asking for sources. I am clueless on how you guys took it as an invitation to a debate with the first reply post starting in a "you have no idea, do you?" which is a bad statement if you want to keep things friendly. I read it over and over and in no way did I see any statement that asked for your opinion about the similarity of demons in other cultures. The reply would have been strong if it was within the topic. But the problem is it's not, since it did not give a proper answer to the request:
"So, does anyone know a good source for learning about Japanese demons, and their connections to Japan's history? Does anyone know any Animes/Mangas that deal with those topics? Or even computer games?
Feel free to discuss anything that has something to do with Japanese demons here. "
As for some, if you don't like what some users post, please ignore them. Don't stalk them and reply to their posts with contempt everywhere, it's childish.
Here's a few:
Reading the literatures of Asian America by Lim, Shirley; Ling, Amy
A Field Guide to Demons, Fairies, Fallen Angels, and Other Subversive Spirits by Mack, Carol; Mack
Asian horror encyclopedia: Asian horror culture in literature, manga and folklore by Bush, Laurence C
etc etc
As for anime and mangas there's ofcourse Inuyasha, NURAHIYON NO MAGO, Spooky Keitaro (ewww), Ghost Hunt
As for everyone:
I'm disappointed honestly. When I read the topic I immediately understood that the guy is only asking for sources. I am clueless on how you guys took it as an invitation to a debate with the first reply post starting in a "you have no idea, do you?" which is a bad statement if you want to keep things friendly. I read it over and over and in no way did I see any statement that asked for your opinion about the similarity of demons in other cultures. The reply would have been strong if it was within the topic. But the problem is it's not, since it did not give a proper answer to the request:
"So, does anyone know a good source for learning about Japanese demons, and their connections to Japan's history? Does anyone know any Animes/Mangas that deal with those topics? Or even computer games?
Feel free to discuss anything that has something to do with Japanese demons here. "
As for some, if you don't like what some users post, please ignore them. Don't stalk them and reply to their posts with contempt everywhere, it's childish.
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I agree with the post above mine, it was not necessary to have a debate on what and when and how or why japanese demons.
On topic, I must say I have very little knowledge on the subject, but Tachyon, are there any other languages than english that you can read? I found some other books than the ones Ryouma Sakamoto found, but in french, and I can't seem to find a translation.
Moreover, the Kojiki (One of the ancient scrolls retracing Japanese history) maybe has some of the myths you are looking for, even though I believe it's more about "good" deities and the creation of Japan. It might be an interesting read though.
On topic, I must say I have very little knowledge on the subject, but Tachyon, are there any other languages than english that you can read? I found some other books than the ones Ryouma Sakamoto found, but in french, and I can't seem to find a translation.
Moreover, the Kojiki (One of the ancient scrolls retracing Japanese history) maybe has some of the myths you are looking for, even though I believe it's more about "good" deities and the creation of Japan. It might be an interesting read though.
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@Chlor:
If you take the demons from the Greek mythology, and add up the mythological creatures that are malicious (which would both fall in the Japanese categories of demons), you ll end up with around 30 (haven't counted it exactly, but you will have no way as much as the Japanese mythology does). The Dwarfs and fey are hardly malicious at all, and I don't understand what they have to do with this topic.
@neyapuckachinha:
Yes there are other languages I can read apart from English, but this neither includes French nor Japanese. But thank you very much for referring me the Kojiki, I love to read primary sources the most. I just ordered an English translation by Basil Hall Chamberlain.
If you take the demons from the Greek mythology, and add up the mythological creatures that are malicious (which would both fall in the Japanese categories of demons), you ll end up with around 30 (haven't counted it exactly, but you will have no way as much as the Japanese mythology does). The Dwarfs and fey are hardly malicious at all, and I don't understand what they have to do with this topic.
@neyapuckachinha:
Yes there are other languages I can read apart from English, but this neither includes French nor Japanese. But thank you very much for referring me the Kojiki, I love to read primary sources the most. I just ordered an English translation by Basil Hall Chamberlain.
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True, a lot of creatures of the Fay are pretty chill, not doing anything but simply float around being supernatural, the same way some of the Japanese demons just do the same, and while numbers of malicious beings are fewer it would be wrong to say that the creatures of the fey are good beings. We have the classical will 'o the wisp that lures people to get lost in the mist and enter the fairy realm where they get trapped for eternity while the faeries suck the life out of them. In norse mythology the Will 'o the Wisp is usually the spirit of a drowned human, and it either lures people to a death similar of their own, or lead them home. The most famous malicious being in Scandinavian folklore would be the Näck or the Nyx, also known as the Grim, a water spirit that takes on the form of a young man playing a fiddle, luring women and children into rivers where they'll drown.
Most creatures in Norse and old Germanic folklore are indeed pretty peaceful, and unlike japanese demons (from what I understand) they won't do anything if you do not provoke them, but on the other hand, if you DO disrespect a creature of the fay, they're most likely to lure you to your death in one way or the other.
Anyhow, to get back on the actual topic: I was passing by my own local library and figured I'd step inside and have a look at books about japanese folklore, sadly the inventory on that topic was extremely scarce but with some help I managed to find an anthology of japanese legends. The book is simply called "Ancient tales and Folklore of Japan" and was written by Richard Gordon-Smith in 1918, it contained about 50 or so, from what I understood, pretty classic legends and tales translated into english. I'm not really well-versed in Jap. Mythology and Folklore, and can't tell you how genuine these tales are, but I guess you could check it out.
Most creatures in Norse and old Germanic folklore are indeed pretty peaceful, and unlike japanese demons (from what I understand) they won't do anything if you do not provoke them, but on the other hand, if you DO disrespect a creature of the fay, they're most likely to lure you to your death in one way or the other.
Anyhow, to get back on the actual topic: I was passing by my own local library and figured I'd step inside and have a look at books about japanese folklore, sadly the inventory on that topic was extremely scarce but with some help I managed to find an anthology of japanese legends. The book is simply called "Ancient tales and Folklore of Japan" and was written by Richard Gordon-Smith in 1918, it contained about 50 or so, from what I understood, pretty classic legends and tales translated into english. I'm not really well-versed in Jap. Mythology and Folklore, and can't tell you how genuine these tales are, but I guess you could check it out.
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Takerial
Lovable Teddy Bear
Tachyon wrote...
Kalistean wrote...
Spoiler:
Except he does in fact include them within his topic of discussion. The key point being "I got interested because I saw them in Inuyasha."
Apparently you miss my point? That what he is asking about doesn't 'just' include hell type demons or along those lines. They branch out into things that are similar to Elves and the Fey in western lore.
Or do you not know that there are plenty of Elves and Fey that are considered evil spirits that do horrible things?
The first and the last time I am responding to you.
I never said that I got interested in this topic by watching Inu Yasha, and I did explicitly state that I am intrigued with the Japanese demons because they are malicious!
I know that you are dumb, and that you won't stop spamming anyway. But please, keep me out of all the nonsense you write.
Why you were intrigued is different than how you got into them. The fact that most of your knowledge seems directly in line with most of the information presented IN Inuyasha (which is inaccurate, surprise surprise.) and that you stated you loved the show because of its portrayal when such a thing is unnecessary leads me to believe you did not really get into them until you saw said show.
You think that all of what is classified as Japanese demons are malicious? Against, they don't call them demons, we do. We are the one that provided the term for them during translation. And probably most of the classifications you are thinking off are not always malicious. A good chunk of them are just mischievous spirits rather than malicious.
Which you don't seem to get through your head.
I also love how you got this bullshit number of "No more than 30 malicious type demons/spirits".
Christian Lore alone has more malicious types of demons/spirits than just 30.
Considering there is numerous named demons and fallen angels, such as Lucifer, Satan, Baal, and multiple others. They even have different classifications of demons and so on.
And this is one solitary Lore in Western History. On just actual Hell-type beings. Which you can go even further if you are considering all malicious types of spirits.
You seem to be using a highly specific definition for Western Lore, which even the highly specific one doesn't even work. While using one fucking loose definition for Japanese lore.
Fucking weeaboo.
