abortion (i forgot what the prop name was)

I'm not going to say that I'm not smart, but my comments about safe sex aren't what make me smart. At least, I hope they're not. I hope that most people know those things, learned them in school, or from siblings or parents or something.

On topic, I heard recently that some girl in some state got a huge list of signatures for a petition to pass a law that says that life starts at conception. That's all it says, that life starts at conception. The plan is to get that acknowledged, and then abortion will essentially be illegal because it'd be murder. I don't believe it's been voted on yet, but I really hope it doesn't pass. Not just because it'd make abortions illegal, but because it could cause a lot of other problems. I saw a small news report on it, and they talked to a doctor, who said that if the law passed, every miscarriage would warrant an investigation.

The 21-year-old girl who started the petition wanted to outlaw abortion, and she thought she could do it in a different way that might have more of an effect, but if the thing passes, she'll have caused some serious shit to go down.



Thanks. You're too kind.

look fetuses and embryos are not missing out on anything big here in the world. think about it, they die before they can even grasp a concept of the world ,and what it is. my sister still does not have a grasp of the true world, and people 45 years old still cant grasp the real world. so really it is all about what the woman wants, not what we think is right or wrong.

It sounds like you condone 45 year old abortions.

And I'm pretty sure you missed his point. Did you happen to read his first three sentences?

How do 45-year-old people not grasp the real world? I understand the real world, and I'm half as old as 45.

Are you making some sort of philosophical, "The world we see is not the real world" statement? Because in that case, no one really "grasps" the "real world," and everything you said is moot.

Okay... I'm more the in between guy since while I do believe that there are better ways to handle an unwanted child, but there have been cases when an abortion is actually necessary such as the mother is ill and keeping the baby will put her life at risk.

To me, abortion is like a gun. To throw it away because it could kill someone is foolish, but to use it at every excuse is also foolish; one should only resort to using it when it's absolutely necessary and all other options have been exhausted.

just to lighten the mood...

To me, I just don't understand why women shouldn't have the right to abort, or be denied the right to make that decision. Why should they sacrifice their lives and welfare for something (I say something, not someone - intentional distinction) that's not even concious, let alone being sentient.

I just find it ironic that it's women who support Pro-Life, that they say that a life is a life and that they don't have a choice in it... which to me sounds like utter BS. I mean, there are also very rational reasons for abortion:
1. Saving the life of the mother,
2. Perserving the mental and physical welfare of the mother,
3. Preventing a birth with congenital defect(s),
4. To lessen the health risks associated with multiple pregnancies.
5. (Most used rationale) Preventing the birth of an unwanted child. (teen pregnancy, rape, financial situation, religion, etc.)

Seriously, wtf is this shit?

Whitelion provides a good argument against abortion while you on the other hand provide good examples of why abortion shouldn't be completely banned.

Gentlemen, I believe I have found the answer to make the majority happy. Now if we could only pass it into law.

i just found another reason to support abortion

stem cell research

@otaku
well, they are using the fetus' hand to masturbate it

That's why I posted

...You DO realize that the stem cells used for research nowadays are collected from the leftover fluid after a birth, right?

The last time we tried using aborted fetuses, the whole practice nearly got banned.

so its better to have aborted fetuses go to waste?

who is "we" anyway, are you a geneticist or scientist otherwise involved with stem cell research?

I think the whole point of abortions is to let a "child" "go to waste."

Also, using the term "we" isn't uncommon when talking about something like this. I doubt Arizth personally tried to use an aborted fetus for research, but everyone understands what he means. No need to take offense to it.

let me rephrase it then.

is it better to let a dead (which i thought to be implied by aborted) fetus go to waste.

Is it better to let a dead possum that's been hit by a car go to waste, or should you eat it?

It's not a matter of whether or not the fetus should be wasted or used for research. A lot of people simply don't like the idea of using aborted fetuses for anything, so when it's been tried, people have bitched a ton, and researchers have had to stop.

well, usually, people dont (want to) eat opposum anyway, so why would someone want to it, just because its dead. in a similar yet different case, if deer jumps before your car, people do seem inclined to eat it. basically because they would usually pay good money to eat it.

and yes, i know the circumstances under which it has almost been banned and i still think its stupid and wasteful.

Whether or not it's wasteful is besides the point here, Eris.

The point is that, when dealing with a subject that in some way may end a "Human Life", even when that "Human Life" would be better described as "An intestinal parasite that is often mistaken as a miracle", or in the case of early abortion, "A non-sentient clump of rapidly dividing cells", great care must be taken in order to appease the angry crowds of people that would object to the definitions I provided to the term "Unborn baby".

You must understand that, as of right now, and up to when Grandchildren of the Internet Generation take political office, the playing field there will be primarily "Old rich white Christians", as the stereotype stands. People such as that, plus the angry crowds bearing the "Pro Life" standard, will prevent practical research that uses humans as test subjects on the grounds of "Ethics and Morality".

The best way I can sum it up is this, taken from a conversation with friends a year ago:

Arizth: That's just fucking dumb. SC research could potentially cure infertility. How are we wasting lives here, exactly?

Stem Cell research can do a lot of great things.

Also, I've eaten roadkill before. Peope do it, man.

aye, the greek name is indeed better, but less people would understand what it means.

either way, i must remember those definitions, i like them. in fact, if i still could, i would rep you for that.

but arent old rich people exactly the kinda crowd that would benefit the most from this kinda research, and my guess is that with the internet and faster information fluctuation this so called god should be taken care of by then.

and yes, its an interesting dilemma if killing 1 person now could save a million in the course of 100 years...is it worth then?