Volaverunt Posts
I really don't know, but it surely made me develop a lot of fetishes I'd never have imagined I would have.
Also, Masterbating? Is it like, mastering a bat or something?
Also, Masterbating? Is it like, mastering a bat or something?
This same issue will be brought up by those same kids when they grow up and see the next generation possibly attending family meetings via holograms or something.
But why would Fakku be your only source of hentai-related things to go as far as paying for a premium membership?
King Dingaling wrote...
Do you know what time it is? Its time for....*drumroll*
You can teach an old dog new tricks, but you can't teach Madonna to act.
Hey, sorry for the very late post, but at that time I was making a long ass reply but for some reason it didn't show up back then so I just said fuck it.
Anyway, I was re-reading the conversation and I admit I was wrong in some cases, and maybe continuing it would lead to nowhere.
So, sorry for bothering you there. And meh.
Anyway, I was re-reading the conversation and I admit I was wrong in some cases, and maybe continuing it would lead to nowhere.
So, sorry for bothering you there. And meh.
Misaki_Chi wrote...
Coconutt wrote...
y00han wrote...
Can you cite where you got this information? pretty profound
http://es.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nadie_se_conoce#Interpretaciones_de_la_estampa
Sorry it's in Spanish.
Coconutt wrote...
At first i was, but then you said that there is a connection between extremism and having a trauma or weak mind or fear of humiliations and i commented on that.Yes, and I already apologized for doing so. But still , my point about religious extremists who go around killing other people is the same.
Volaverunt wrote...
I am not talking about extreme ideologies, but extremist people.The most simple things that we see daily like some girl asking for attention on facebook is the product of some kind of problem, big or small. Being an extremist is not an exception.
Or at least that's the conclusion I got by reading and talking to psychologists acquaintances. As I said, you can also look for it on google. If that's not the case then give me proof.
Coconutt wrote...
I can't prove that every single extremist doesn't have a psychological problem no more than you can prove that they do have one. If you actually knew what the word means (even though i tried to explain it to you), i think you would understand what i am talking about.The point is you don't have to have mental problems in order to do extreme things, because if a human believes without a shadow of a doubt that what he does is legal, moral, acceptable, right and justified, in spite of opinions and evidence proving you wrong, a human can do anything.
Again as above.
And I said the facebook girl as an example just to show how every act can be explained psychologically. And going by that any act of extremism can be explained too.
Coconutt wrote...
I didn't ignore anything, i just didn't understand your point.And of coarse killing another human being has repercussions, but if you are not willing to live with those repercussions the alternative to that is that you can, might or will die (in the examples of self defense and defending yourself against an attacking nation).
As I said, just ignore it if you just feel it adds nothing to this. I agree with it.
Coconutt wrote...
What the hell are you talking about, of coarse the war with ISIS is about good and right. They (ISIS) believe that what they are doing is moral right given to them by god. That is the whole point as to how they justify the war to themselves. They think it is moral for them to invade other nations, acquire more power and land and resources to themselves from others.And again you saying they are terrorist carries as much weight as another person saying they are heroes.
That's just an excuse, many other Islamic groups have manifested their opposition to them.
I agree you are right, in their views they are doing what's morally correct, but then again even then killing without hesitation is not something a sane person would do.
Coconutt wrote...
And i already established that there is nothing wrong in killing somebody for self-defense. Not legally and not morally. And this fact shows how there is no absolute moral when it comes to killing another human being. Killing another human being is not objectively bad.If you don't understand that, i go as far as to say there is something wrong in your head.
I understand that, but the fact that killing someone is not objectively bad still makes me think. Somehow it makes it seem that killing is sometimes good, even if it was self-defense. Or perhaps I might be seeing it the wrong way.
But oh well.
Coconutt wrote...
That is a very cute single instance of religious people behaving non-religiously. And i seriously doubt the history in that time and that place went as 'smoothly' as you describe it went.That's part of history of Spain. Feel free to look for it and prove me wrong.
Coconutt wrote...
And again you are either missing the point or ignoring the point, which is that when ever religious people behave nicely, it is because they are not following their religious books like the bible and quran. It means they are following their secular morality.I seriously doubt secular morality was even something at that age given that the regions and people by that time were heavily influenced by religion.
Coconutt wrote...
I didn't mentioned it because it doesn't mention that. Those rules apply all the time and always according to muslims. So to imply "that is how an ideology/religion works" is just false.You mean fundamentalists ones, those who always try . If that were the case then as I said every muslim now and before would be on a killing spree disregarding secular morality. That's why the Quran clearly says that in times of peace noone should do bad things. Only when others threaten them, then their actions become "justifiable". Not that I'm in favor of that or something.
Coconutt wrote...
And what is your point? That it was moral for the religious people to massacre the men, women and children of the other tribes and nations because god helped them?See above.
Coconutt wrote...
How adorable that the books with the worst moral guidance also have few 'nice' advices, so that we can occasionally act nicely in between the verses where god commands us to stone homosexuals to death and also behead the people who decide to leave the faith.I also think that said actions are debatable. But ignoring the good teachings the Quran has because of the other bad parts is just being unbiased.
Misaki_Chi wrote...
Cononutt’s point still stands even with your reply.An extremist is a person who holds extreme or fanatical political or religious views, especially one who resorts to or advocates extreme action. This can also hold true for a group as well. Extremism doesn't just relate to religious groups and basically their views can be radical for whatever reason. Raping and sharing a bunch of women, beating people they don’t like, murder, feel like they are fighting for the good of their nation, fight for personal independence are all different things such groups can do if they feel they can do it.
I admit that, personally, I think that these "whatever reasons" have a psychological background.
I repeat myself, maybe I went too far as saying that they had mental illness and the like.
Misaki_Chi wrote...
So your now using a bitchy girl posting on Facebook as your counter argument….. this doesn't really equate to what the discussions about because usually people who are nasty over the internet just like to dick/troll around. Also keep in mind an extreme person =/= an extremist because the morals are lacking. Another way you can look at it is if a person says something nasty to you, will they back up their threats? Extreme people may do stupid and crazy things, but they lack the conviction to go through with it rationally and their morals don’t have to be extreme.I would suggest taking a psychology class, because comparing Facebook to extremists is a bit of a stretch that isn't very factual. If anything it was quite the contrary for the main reason I just stated.
It's not a counter argument, I'm just giving an example that even the most simple thing has a psychological background. Even troll attitudes can sometimes be explained (but I wasn't talking about them).
As I said, if that's not the case, feel free to give me proof.
Misaki_Chi wrote...
Actually one of the main goals of terrorists is to cause chaos and to intimidate others/cause harm to other humans. The goal behind it can be for many reasons, but power is not the main one. What coconut says is not false; not everyone will agree with terrorists, but there are people who would side with them and their cause. Morally people side with who they want to side with because personally everyone has the ability to choose for themselves.You morally feel that terrorists are bad and that is a majority decision that is felt with most people. Those who practice terrorism or even extreme ideals will feel that the morals behind their causes are right even if proven otherwise.
Misaki_Chi wrote...
Btw you know that even in religious groups that the death of another person can happen too? There are many stories about religious figures and groups having scandals, illegal financial transactions, and even murder? I remember some guy who ran a church back home pretty much slept with the whole convent. I think he was killed because he was laundering money or he tried to skip town on some shady people or something. Anyways the point of this is to say, even in religious settings things can happen. People can say they value a life, even preach it, but that doesn't mean that they morally uphold so or will do it in the face of corruption. The seven deadly sins are a powerful thing that can corrupt even the most holy of sanctions.NOTE: I'd suggest reading/watching the story of Jim Jones. He was a religious leader who started with good morals and ideals, but those slowly got corrupted over time. In the end he killed his own followers via the iconic death "Kool-Aid and cyanide poisoning" which lead to the death of over 900 people and 300 children. Even though he was religious and morally lead is convent with good intentions, those morals became corrupt and lead to him convincing others to take their lives for his cause. Worst part was he did realize he was morally wrong even till the end and took a cowards death via gunshot to the head. Adds to the notion that morals are subjective because if a person can be swayed to change their views then their morals can change along suit.
I'm fully aware that these things happen, but what I'm just trying to say is that it has a psychological background. Again, if that's not the case then I will gladly change my point of view.
What I was talking about in the first was how religious extremists don't count when it comes to saying how morality is subjective when they are acting like life is something with no value. (as is the case of psychopaths). But I think it got out of my hands, as I said, I was too hard for saying that they were mentally ill.
Misaki_Chi wrote...
It sounds like you’re mixing up personal feelings with the concept of factual notions. Just because you yourself see extremists and terrorists in a certain fashion, does not mean that your arguments will hold up in a debate. People may personally agree with your views, but factually you are letting your personal feelings on such subjects get in the way of you seeing the bigger picture.I can personally think that terrorists are bad and that extremists can be annoying, but I write my stances similar to coconutt’s because your personal vendetta’s do not prove for fact.
Not sure if you would understand this bit, but take a debate class or watch some politics on the news and you’ll see how people can easily make such points defensible.
If this was a full debate on how extremists are mentally ill or not, then I'd agree and, as I said before, I made the wrong of choice of words and it eventually got out of my hands. I apologize for that. But some points I made still stand.
Coconutt wrote...
I am not 100% sure you know what extremism means, because it does not mean or is not equal to religious suicide bombings only. Extremism means that you have a belief or point of view that is far more extreme than (most of the time) the people who you agree with.
In politics [...]
I tought you were talking about about religious extremists who have no regrets in killing other people.
Coconutt wrote...
Being an extremist doesn't mean anything else other than having a more 'extreme' point of view or ideology that usually differs from the majority opinion.Yes, an extreme ideology can be the by product of mental illness, trauma and other factors, but all i am arguing that it isn't all of the time or even most of the time.
I am not talking about extreme ideologies, but extremist people.
The most simple things that we see daily like some girl asking for attention on facebook is the product of some kind of problem, big or small. Being an extremist is not an exception.
Or at least that's the conclusion I got by reading and talking to psychologists acquaintances. As I said, you can also look for it on google. If that's not the case then give me proof.
Coconutt wrote...
I am not sure what you want me to ask them.Well you can ignore that if you want, you said (or implied) that killing someone can be justifiable in some cases, and I just wanted to say that killing someone has repercutions on you on the ling term, but I think that it didn't have place in this discussion.
Cocnonutt wrote...
You entirely missed my point or ignored it. Yes, in our eyes they are terrorists!
In other peoples eyes they are heroes!
This is the whole point why morality is subjective and not objective.
Their war is not about good or right. So morality isn't a factor when it comes to this. They are fighting for power, that's why I said they are terrorists.
Besides I was talking about killing someone. It's not a matter of "for some people it's right, for other it's not", because there are things that are objectively bad or good, like killing people. A life is a valuable thing for at least all religions. Islam included. If you have no regrets in killing someone (as is the case with said terrorsts) then there is something wrong with your head.
Coconutt wrote...
Quran Verse 9:111
"Lo! Allah hath bought from the believers their lives and their wealth because the Garden will be theirs: they shall fight in the way of Allah and shall slay and be slain. It is a promise which is binding on Him in the Torah and the Gospel and the Qur'an. Who fulfilleth His covenant better than Allah? Rejoice then in your bargain that ye have made, for that is the supreme triumph."
Quran Verse 9:5
"Then, when the sacred months have passed, slay the idolaters wherever ye find them, and take them (captive), and besiege them, and prepare for them each ambush. But if they repent and establish worship and pay the poor-due, then leave their way free. Lo! Allah is Forgiving, Merciful."
Quran Verse 9:29:
"Fight against such of those who have been given the Scripture as believe not in Allah nor the Last Day, and forbid not that which Allah hath forbidden by His messenger, and follow not the Religion of Truth, until they pay the tribute readily, being brought low."
Quran Verse 5:33:
"The only reward of those who make war upon Allah and His messenger and strive after corruption in the land will be that they will be killed or crucified, or have their hands and feet on alternate sides cut off, or will be expelled out of the land. Such will be their degradation in the world, and in the Hereafter theirs will be an awful doom;"
And believe me when i say i could go on.
To say that islam has EVER been a religion of peace is just outright ridicules.
Everything good coming out of that religion is because of secular morality, not islamic morality.
See, have you ever gone to Granada (Spain)? You can see a lot of Arab buildings where Arabs would go to reunite and adore their god and just some streets far from those place are a lot of Christian churchs that date from the same time. (Around 1300-1400) Which means that by then at least arabs and christians lived in peace without killing each others.
You seem well versed in Quran (unless you just searched for it on google), but why didn't you mention that it mostly applies when Islam is attacked? That's just how an ideology/religion works. Even the Christian Bible tells about how God helped his chosen people in battles.
There also verses from the Quran that encourage them to always search for more knowledge, to always put effort on education. It wasn't just a matter of secular morality.
Coconutt wrote...
Having a trauma? Fear of humiliation? Even weak minded?You just draw conclusions out of your ass it seems to me, for sure there are some people who fit into that description, but to every single extremist that is out there, i doubt it.
You can go ask a psychologist his view on extremists and he will give a more detailed explanation. Or you can also search about it on google.
Coconutt wrote...
It depends on the reason, i don't have a problem killing another human being in self defense (at least i think i don't, never been and i hope i never will be in a situation like that).I also don't have a problem killing enemy combatants of a attacking nation. (For example ISIS.)
But maybe you are talking about killing other people for pleasure and of coarse i am against that and think it is wrong.
Of course I'm talking about that. And even then, killing enemies or killing someone on self-defense is not something that makes you feel good neither.
I don't think you have ever killed someone but you can ask a war veteran about those thigns and make your own conclusions.
Coconutt wrote...
You see, this is the whole point of morality, you think and i think and most of the western world thinks that (for example) the terrorists of ISIS are fucked in the head and their doings immoral.
But there are probably millions of people who think that their doings are moral, that they are spreading the word of Allah in the form of Qoran, and who ever doesn't listen is an infidel that needs to be killed.
This doesn't mean that they are fucked in the head or have a mental illness. To them selves they are perfectly sane and logical, and they think what they are doing is morally right.
THEY.
ARE.
TERRORISTS.
They are extremists too.
Not every Islamic person thinks that killing someone in the name of Allah is good, or that everyone who doesn't think like him is an infidel who needs to get his head beheaded.
You can already see that in news and articles, innocent civilians die and want this ISIS stuff to end as soons as possible.
On a side note, the Qoran doesn't tell you to go out and bomb yourself or behead people. Those are things that extremists islamic zealots came up with. Islam was a religion of peace. Many Islamic people who travelled around the world were always tolerant and even prone to teach everything they knew to other people (geometry, astronomy, even the numbers we use today)
erogamer wrote...
So do you think that those hardcore anti-gay Christians have mental problems?Yes. Being extremist over something means having a very weak mind, maybe having a trauma, fear of humillation, etc. Do you really think those people don't have problems?
Also, not all people against homosexuality are neither hardcore nor Christians.
You can belong to any religious movement and still act like a sane and normal person without going around telling people they are going to hell. After all that's not what Jesus taught.
Maybe I was too harsh when I said "mental illness" or "mental problems" but I hope you get my point.
Also, I was talking about killing people, not hating people.
Coconutt wrote...
How does being an extremist equal to having a mental problem?Being an (religious) extremist just means that humans are willing to do and/or kill anybody for almost anything and any means necessary, but that doesn't mean you have a mental problem.
See above.
Also, if you don't have a problem killing someone then there is something wrong with you.
Coconutt wrote...
Just because you think they are fucked in their heads, doesn't mean they have mental illness. They ARE fucked up.
Misaki_Chi wrote...
Even though many people may not agree with the actions and mindset of various extreme groups, that doesn't mean that they have a mental illness.I repeat, maybe I made the wrong choice of words.
Coconutt wrote...
Religious extremism is not a mental illness, its people with really strong faith and the belief that what they are doing is right.Are you talking about those islamic terrorist groups? They are fucked up in their heads.
And how is being an extremist not having some sort of mental problem?
baconlol wrote...
Morality by its definition probably is subjective. Because what is right to some people, is wrong to others. Though I believe there is a point where it gets less subjective.I'm pretty sure that killing someone is repulsive for both believers and non-believers.
