Any Dota players?

To say that Troll can't kill skilled people is whack to me...How are you supposed to run away from stunlock? A good Troll can easily catch people offguard in the right situations. All he has to do is use ult right before contact and the enemy is dead.

@Fayt: if that is how you build Troll it is no wonder he can't carry. Cuirass and Heart? These are fantastic items late game sure, but Troll needs damage... Not attack speed and HP. What is the purpse of having the attack speed buff and permabash when get tanking and attack speed items?


If you guys want to say that he was downgraded a little bit as a solo hero (by that I mean idiots who play 1v1 games) I'll agree with that, but he is still just as good of a carry hero as he was before. Permabashing someone is still just as easy as it was before, and now he has a global attack speed buff to make it possible for anyone. *sigh* I guess I'm the loner in this debate so I give up. 8)

wait what, permabash? even the old troll warlord with the old cranium basher BARELY gets a real permabash (and 1 basher makes him able to kill but not permabash, unless you get lucky; a stunner can still escape, although the old troll had the movement speed to catch up), you would need at least 2 bashers to truly "permabash"

do not forget that in the early stages, you are forced to lane alone or with a teammate. Team battles arent prominent there, and if you cannot handle your lane at the start of the game, you have officially lost the game (unless your teammate is doing much better than the opponent at your lane).

his initial attack speed is horrible at best, unless you get atk speed boosting items so he can stack up his passive fast (which means using ulti at the start of the battle, which means fleeing enemy unless they are noob) to top it all off, basher isnt stackable, and 10% bash with horrible initial attack speed is HARDLY permabash. even if you score 1 lucky bash, the enemy can still run.

I have just had another game using troll, he shines really well when crushing towers in a team, or when "surprising" your enemies by boosting your teammates from across the map. But when soloing, he is useless, It wasnt until i got SnY and butterfly (and BoT) where i can finally kill someone that is NOT a stunner ALONE! SnY alone can maim the person, but their teamamates would be there before you can kill him off.

From that last match, my main role was to blind people and give Atk speed boosts during tower breaking or scaring enemies off. Other than that, its too easy to stop a troll before he can "stack" enough of the atk speed buff to be a deadly attacker.

Team battles is a different story, but there are alot of team oriented heroes (that i have listed) that can do even better in teams and can even handle themselves alone as i have stated before, so my point still firmly stands =/

also:
@naoto: i never said theres such things as a team battle without team dependancy, i said "team dependancy is a sign of weakness" meaning that he is HIGHLY dependant on teammates and cannot handle anything alone, unless its a techies, but even techies would suicide on his face and kill him.

Why is attack speed so important early game? From my experience last hitting creeps has nothing to do with multiple attacks. And yes permabash is rediculously easy even without a basher. And it was just as easy with one basher in the older versions. There is no time for a stunner to do anything or for anyone to blink away. :/ Apparently we play two different versions of dota. 8)

when i said initial attack speed, i meant at the start of a battle, not early game. Without good attack speed items, his attack speed is horrible unless he uses his ulti right off the bat to stack his attack speed buff.

not once have i had a real "stun lock" out of all the games ive played, and at most, i manage to pull off 2-3 stuns in 1 battle, but it was hardly a "stunlock" as a split second window would give the enemy enough time to blink/leap/stun/slow/windwalk/etc

theoretically speaking, he needs to pull off 10 attacks every 2 seconds (5 attacks per second) with a 10% bash chance to pull off a "stun lock" (stun lock definition: to permanently be "locked" into a stun and COMPLETELY be unable to do anything until you or your enemy dies), even the old troll with max level, and 2 butterfies cant do 5 attacks per second >>;

Now if you are lucky, you will need less than 5 attacks per second, but if you really want to reliably and constantly "permabash", you will need more than 5 attacks per second, maybe around 15 attacks per 2 seconds or 20 attacks per 2 seconds to be safe =O now that is impossible even for those "RPG" games where you can spam agility tomes. so in theory alone, its literally impossible to permabash already D= your game may be rigged.

we must indeed be playing a different version of dota, or the opponents you were playing against just didnt know how to stun or run ;P

I'm not sure with this 'new' 6.60 dota map .
I'm getting mad with that thing .

never played as troll before so i wouldnt know but i have to agree with the Huskar and Vengeful part Huskar can run to 3 heroes kill one and escape. saw it happen and Vengeful can really kill you cuz that stun is just too long and if you managed to escape theres always the swap skill <_<

That's why Vengeful is some kinda dangerous .
Even Axe can't touch her properly .

indeed, vengeful is one of the most popular heroes to pick during tournament play, which was why her ulti got a range nerf long ago.

then,her Command Aura is the great thing in teamplay,and if she works with Lycanthrope,there's no way to stop them .
OWNING!

Indeed.... Lycanthrope+Vengeful is a deadly combination...
Just look at their skill...
stunner+chaser... Aww.... damn
so anyone play the map 6.66? i really confused with Ancient Apparatus(if i didn't wrong) Murlock seems great too... (Except for his poor attack speed)

Ancient appartioner and Slark/Murlock ?

three words,
"THEY ARE IMBA"

hnnn~ dota.. garena?

I do...
you too, Abu?
i often played at Malaysia, or Thailand Server.
Because Indonesia doesn't have any server at Garena XD...

i always play at philippines.. XD

uhhh its not the attack speed, it his health thats the problem

Haha, not too far from here ^^.
I guess when my net connection has been repaired, i will visit philippine XD.



Yes, and his status as melee attacker = weakness too, but still
IMBA

Yeah... that bastard has been raking of my stats for his own... and I thought Razor's 2nd skill was imba >_<. Murlok's SS and stat stealing skill is just ridiculous.

well melee is a disadvantage but thats not really a big factor since he can get close fast and is able to make sure the enemy cannot move too far

my username is todofootlong101 be sure to add me.. or pm me if im online XD