Gaddafi is dead. What will happen with Lybia now?
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Rather than hapiness and satisfaction for his death I feel a worried about the future of Lybia and the world. Who will take control of Lybia? What will happen with that little country? . I believe that leaders from rebeld forces will fight for power and territory in order to take the country. It will not be the first time.
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Scenarios:
1. Another dicatorship.
2. Islamisation.
3. A really crappy democracy.
4. Even more chaos, war, discord, etc.
Why? Because Libya haven't seen democracy or a proper free society in like... ever, so how are they supposed to make one from scratch by themselves? Hopefully time will prove me wrong.
1. Another dicatorship.
2. Islamisation.
3. A really crappy democracy.
4. Even more chaos, war, discord, etc.
Why? Because Libya haven't seen democracy or a proper free society in like... ever, so how are they supposed to make one from scratch by themselves? Hopefully time will prove me wrong.
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Salaryman Man wrote...
Scenarios: 1. Another dicatorship.
2. Islamisation.
3. A really crappy democracy.
4. Even more chaos, war, discord, etc.
Why? Because Libya haven't seen democracy or a proper free society in like... ever, so how are they supposed to make one from scratch by themselves? Hopefully time will prove me wrong.
I "vote" for 4 but the Americans with their weapons at my back will change it to 3.
I'm fairly certain that if no one intervened at all that Gadhafi (I've seen like 10 different spellings of his name, which one is right?) would have died anyways. I dont know if the "rebels" had a single leader or hero/ine in which case it would be easy to say "oh that guy/girl is the new (title)".
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All depends on who the rebels are.
If they were people wanting a Democracy, they will get a shitty form of democracy.
If the majority were Islamic extremists we will get another Iran.
If the new "government" doesn't take solid control it'll turn into another Somalia.
I'm voting for a strained Democracy that teeters on the edge of destruction of Qaddafi loyalists continue to fight and harass the "traitors
If they were people wanting a Democracy, they will get a shitty form of democracy.
If the majority were Islamic extremists we will get another Iran.
If the new "government" doesn't take solid control it'll turn into another Somalia.
I'm voting for a strained Democracy that teeters on the edge of destruction of Qaddafi loyalists continue to fight and harass the "traitors
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Gravity cat
the adequately amused
I'm happy for Lybia that Gadaffi's reign of terror has been stopped, but now there's this power vacuum and nobody is really in charge at the moment so anyone can do anything and that's frightening. Soon enough, someone will step up and take charge, they could be a single person who has the capability to be next Gadaffi, or a group of people will be appointed leaders in the form of a new, possibly corrupt government and the whole thing starts all over again.
However, if Lybia had some sort of guidance from the same "foreign countries" that intervened with helping Lybia gain some sort of order like they did with assisting in taking down Gadaffi, then maybe they do have a shot at being a "normal" state. But, I could be wrong.
However, if Lybia had some sort of guidance from the same "foreign countries" that intervened with helping Lybia gain some sort of order like they did with assisting in taking down Gadaffi, then maybe they do have a shot at being a "normal" state. But, I could be wrong.
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Fiery_penguin_of_doom wrote...
All depends on who the rebels are.I'm sure some Libyans were fighting for democracy, but a lot of it is (if I've understood it correctly) just tribal politics, with every tribe in Libya having their own loyalties and interests. And of course there are many foreign interests as well. I mean, if it were all about good moral and democracy, Nato should be overthrowing other oppressive Arab governments too by now. But they aren't, so there must've been something special about Libya, making them give a shit (oil perhaps?).
And then, of course, there's the Muslim Brotherhood, al-Qaida, etc., making use of these kinds of conflicts to gain support -- that's what they did in Egypt after all.
Also, media is way too supportive towards the rebels so there must be something fishy going on, according to my logic and instincts. And I have awesome instincts, by the way.
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Either way this will turn out to be a chaotic event....
Gaddafi is dead.. who will take his power?
I believe governments around the world will try to obtain control Libya.. if not then I guess the neighboring land will take it over.....
I doubt the people from within will take it over since they lack political knowledge... if a guy with a beard takes over then there will be guarantied another dictatorship in Libya....
"If a country is left weakened in its state then other countries will come and overcome it".... remember this....
Who knows maybe countries around the world will have war over the control from Libya (Just a guess)
Gaddafi is dead.. who will take his power?
I believe governments around the world will try to obtain control Libya.. if not then I guess the neighboring land will take it over.....
I doubt the people from within will take it over since they lack political knowledge... if a guy with a beard takes over then there will be guarantied another dictatorship in Libya....
"If a country is left weakened in its state then other countries will come and overcome it".... remember this....
Who knows maybe countries around the world will have war over the control from Libya (Just a guess)
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Salaryman Man wrote...
Fiery_penguin_of_doom wrote...
All depends on who the rebels are.I'm sure some Libyans were fighting for democracy, but a lot of it is (if I've understood it correctly) just tribal politics, with every tribe in Libya having their own loyalties and interests. And of course there are many foreign interests as well. I mean, if it were all about good moral and democracy, Nato should be overthrowing other oppressive Arab governments too by now. But they aren't, so there must've been something special about Libya, making them give a shit (oil perhaps?).
And then, of course, there's the Muslim Brotherhood, al-Qaida, etc., making use of these kinds of conflicts to gain support -- that's what they did in Egypt after all.
Also, media is way too supportive towards the rebels so there must be something fishy going on, according to my logic and instincts. And I have awesome instincts, by the way.
99% of people don't really know anything about the Lybian conflict. They don't know who the rebels are or what started the conflict.
This is what started it all.
Houses. A while later Jamal al-Hajji a writer and activist
call[ed] on the Internet for demonstrations to be held in support of greater freedoms in Libya" inspired by the Tunisian and Egyptian revolutions.
What did they need to protest for? They had free education, plenty of housing subsidized by the Government, comprehensive social welfare services, and general standards of health that were among the highest in Africa.
Don't get me wrong, He was no saint but, I seriously question the American involvement in that conflict. We invaded a nation that was not a threat to us under "Humanitarian" reasons. Why haven't we "aided" the Syrian rebels yet? Probably because Syria doesn't have any oil but, that's just my theory.
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Fiery_penguin_of_doom wrote...
99% of people don't really know anything about the Lybian conflict. They don't know who the rebels are or what started the conflict.This is what started it all.
Houses. A while later Jamal al-Hajji a writer and activist
call[ed] on the Internet for demonstrations to be held in support of greater freedoms in Libya" inspired by the Tunisian and Egyptian revolutions.
What did they need to protest for? They had free education, plenty of housing subsidized by the Government, comprehensive social welfare services, and general standards of health that were among the highest in Africa.
Don't get me wrong, He was no saint but, I seriously question the American involvement in that conflict. We invaded a nation that was not a threat to us under "Humanitarian" reasons. Why haven't we "aided" the Syrian rebels yet? Probably because Syria doesn't have any oil but, that's just my theory.
Oh God. Oh God. Oh God. Please tell me it wasnt just houses that started all of that? I feel sick to my stomach now. It feels like all of that government subsidized stuff didnt mean anything. (Ignoring how much it would cost) there are alot of homeless people around the world who would kill to have those things. I wouldnt mind a bit of an idiot as a political leader to have that..actually in alot of countries we do have a political idiot and free education, etc.
The States havent gone to Syria's side probably because its "just a [desert] war, but a struggle for [demoilcracy]...." Besides who wants to get quagmire-d in one of those for 10 years?
But all 60's jokes aside. I cant help but wonder if it was a good idea to rebel after seeing the cause a-la FPoD. It gives me the feeling of "you might be throwing away something good you know" considering about 1000 miles south-south-east isnt exactly a bed of roses.
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Fiery_penguin_of_doom wrote...
We invaded a nation that was not a threat to us under "Humanitarian" reasons. Why haven't we "aided" the Syrian rebels yet? Probably because Syria doesn't have any oil but, that's just my theory.Exactly my point. This whole thing felt wrong from the very beginning to me. Of course the Libyans should have the right to have a democracy, but you can't force these things. Evolution beats revolution everytime.
And besides, democracy wasn't what they wanted to begin with, apparently.
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Personally for my opinion I believe that governments around the world ( meaning whoever was involved in this situation) will have a serious talk to one another about who is gonna take over Libya.
Could be a serious "secret" debate about this matter and what other countries can do to benefit from it.
Take a look at Kosovo ( My homeland :)...)
Countries have aided Kosovo in desperate times but in FACT they were just benefiting from this country by taking control over it a little at a time....
ALL my albanian friends and family have told me that Kosovo has important and valuable minerals under their grounds and I suspected the aid were just a cover up to take control of those valuable minerals since it means BIG MONEY!!!
The same goes for the Middle East countries....
War was NEVER to maintain peace but to GAIN something from it.
Otherwise it wouldn't be worth sticking our noses in it.
Could be a serious "secret" debate about this matter and what other countries can do to benefit from it.
Take a look at Kosovo ( My homeland :)...)
Countries have aided Kosovo in desperate times but in FACT they were just benefiting from this country by taking control over it a little at a time....
ALL my albanian friends and family have told me that Kosovo has important and valuable minerals under their grounds and I suspected the aid were just a cover up to take control of those valuable minerals since it means BIG MONEY!!!
The same goes for the Middle East countries....
War was NEVER to maintain peace but to GAIN something from it.
Otherwise it wouldn't be worth sticking our noses in it.
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I prefer a civil war. If they continue to have a fight among the we can have more jobs here by selling them the weapon we made. Which also means more death to them and more jobs to us.
The most important now is not the crisis of others but of our own. We need to act before other take our jobs.
Blaming on others are just plain sick, yes i still don't like the tragedy on 9-11 but fuck that, it's not like we can bring them back rather than that i prefer forget all that and move forward without looking back. Those who look back at the tragedy and cry are the one that making our life like shit today.
And yes! i do hate that MR. BUSH, for he was the one reason the world plunge to the 'new greater depression'. Stop funding the military start investing in finding new kind of fuel..
The most important now is not the crisis of others but of our own. We need to act before other take our jobs.
Blaming on others are just plain sick, yes i still don't like the tragedy on 9-11 but fuck that, it's not like we can bring them back rather than that i prefer forget all that and move forward without looking back. Those who look back at the tragedy and cry are the one that making our life like shit today.
And yes! i do hate that MR. BUSH, for he was the one reason the world plunge to the 'new greater depression'. Stop funding the military start investing in finding new kind of fuel..
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Gaddafi's death, unarmed and begging for mercy, without being brought to trial implies a lot of negative things for the future of the country.
1) There was no standing orders to take him alive.
2) There were orders to take him alive, but those orders were ignored.
2.a) If those orders were ignored, the fighters who killed him had better be brought to answer for that.
The first would imply that the people now in power have no problem with extra judicial killing, ie they will kill people who oppose them. The second is not so bad unless the people who killed him weren't brought to court for disobeying orders -- that also implies a lot of the people in power.
1) There was no standing orders to take him alive.
2) There were orders to take him alive, but those orders were ignored.
2.a) If those orders were ignored, the fighters who killed him had better be brought to answer for that.
The first would imply that the people now in power have no problem with extra judicial killing, ie they will kill people who oppose them. The second is not so bad unless the people who killed him weren't brought to court for disobeying orders -- that also implies a lot of the people in power.
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I'll keep it short.
South Africa.
Basically, years, if not decades, of civil war only to have the leaders of a "victor" party be killed and it starts all over again. I can see the same thing happening to Libya. Possibly the same when troops withdraw from the Middle East like was promised.
South Africa.
Basically, years, if not decades, of civil war only to have the leaders of a "victor" party be killed and it starts all over again. I can see the same thing happening to Libya. Possibly the same when troops withdraw from the Middle East like was promised.
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Salaryman Man wrote...
Fiery_penguin_of_doom wrote...
We invaded a nation that was not a threat to us under "Humanitarian" reasons. Why haven't we "aided" the Syrian rebels yet? Probably because Syria doesn't have any oil but, that's just my theory.Exactly my point. This whole thing felt wrong from the very beginning to me. Of course the Libyans should have the right to have a democracy, but you can't force these things. Evolution beats revolution everytime.
And besides, democracy wasn't what they wanted to begin with, apparently.
Why do you think Italy and France were the first ones to get upset over it. They get most of their oil from Libya. The U.S only gets less than 2% of oil from Libya, that's why most American politicians didn't and don't care
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Fiery_penguin_of_doom wrote...
Libya ruled by Sharia law.I don't wanna say I told you so, but...
EDIT: Also, never mind scenario 1 and 4, it's probably just going to be 2 and 3, after all. Maybe a liiittle 4, but mostly 2 and 3.
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I rarely believe that Libya will have a reliable leader....
Since there exists laws that is so ridiculous and oppresses the innocent citizens in there....
Countries in the middle east will ALWAYS have laws involving rules from tribes and such in the past and follow certain traditions they have themselves cooked up...
Look at Kosovo for an example...
Even though tribes came in from Islamic cities and lectured us on Islam we still prefer the traditions we ourselves have made and that tradition has no examples of religion whatsoever...
They just pick out the small details in the whole book what they find beneficial for their own cause and use it as a law in their tradition....
"If a women is seen walking without wearing a hijab ( cloth over head to cover most of her femininity) then spit on her and throw her stones because she "betrayed her religion".... that is the kind of law they make and men over there find it amusing abusing a women for not wearing her cloth right though they do it for their own pleasure...
Such laws will still exist even if Libya has a new leader.. because it's just how most of these guys work over there....
" I find women to be praised upon since they bring out the best in us and cook and clean for us and even hug us even if we don't deserve it, they should be loved simply because they exist as beings who are MORE than men."
" I am Legendary_Dollci and I approve this message"
Since there exists laws that is so ridiculous and oppresses the innocent citizens in there....
Countries in the middle east will ALWAYS have laws involving rules from tribes and such in the past and follow certain traditions they have themselves cooked up...
Look at Kosovo for an example...
Even though tribes came in from Islamic cities and lectured us on Islam we still prefer the traditions we ourselves have made and that tradition has no examples of religion whatsoever...
They just pick out the small details in the whole book what they find beneficial for their own cause and use it as a law in their tradition....
"If a women is seen walking without wearing a hijab ( cloth over head to cover most of her femininity) then spit on her and throw her stones because she "betrayed her religion".... that is the kind of law they make and men over there find it amusing abusing a women for not wearing her cloth right though they do it for their own pleasure...
Such laws will still exist even if Libya has a new leader.. because it's just how most of these guys work over there....
" I find women to be praised upon since they bring out the best in us and cook and clean for us and even hug us even if we don't deserve it, they should be loved simply because they exist as beings who are MORE than men."
" I am Legendary_Dollci and I approve this message"