Kamp Kuzma: The Operators' Campgrounds (For Operating)

*continues browsing*

Well then it is 2251 hour here, end of the weekend and end of the first day of winter. Poured like hell which was a nice welcome and even Kei came over for a while.

Kei unfortunately is having trouble with his net, leaving him disabled for sometime until he calls the service provider this week. Until then 2IC does what a 2IC needs to, Lance will be in charge until Kei gets his stuff together.

On that note I'd like to leave a little topic of conversation while I head off to the cruel reality of dreamland.

"In an everyday situation, what firearm would you carry."

Discuss to detail your reasons, what situation you'd expect to use it in, etc and exchange notes and ideas. I'll tell y'all what I'd use tomorrow.

Hmm.

Id carry something reliable and small. But i don't know about what caliber, either .22LR or 9mm. Mostly for home defence weapon.

But what gun exactly, no clue. What my limited knowledge tells me either Glock, SIG or something made by H&K.

Aye aye. Taking command.

As for carry. Well I must go with two aspects of: What I would like to carry and what I am able to carry.

As of now I carry my CZ 75 in 9mm loading a 115 grain Sellier&Bellot FMJ with a new production magazine (tm. 16 instead of 15 round per mag) and round in the chamber hammer down.

Of what I would like to carry it's fairly simple: I am currently considering these options:
A CZ 82 in 9mm Mak it's compact it's versatile and reliable if you don't get one in horrible shape but the problem is the parts are not manufactured so it might be a nightmare getting spare parts if they broke.
A CZ P-07 which is an evolution of CZ 75 P-07 Duty in 9mm Para has exchangeable back straps and some other improvements over Duty (which I like), but the new gun is expensive for me as of right now.
H&K USP Compact in either .45 or 9mm. If it's good enough for Bundeswehr it certainly is for me. I still did not decided if 8+1 of .45 or 13+1 of 9mm is better and I will explain that later, but this gun I find really sympathetic by both design and how well it fits my hand.

Now you noticed that I included only SA/DA pistols in my selection because that is a trigger system I prefer over DAO of things like Glocks or S&W M&P and it is a personal taste of preference.

Now to the ammo. I like 9mm for it's overall versatility and ease of purchase versus performance. It is most used pistol calibre on this planet.
But our law states that any projectile with "increased wounding effect" is illegal for personal protection and can be purchased only for exception of hunting and it is heavily regulated. Because of that I can only use ball ammunition.
The problem with 9mm is that it kinda relies on the same thing the 5.56 does. Speed. Because of that and FMJ rounds the 9mm does have a fairly hight stakes for overpenetration which could harm someone that I do not intend to in a defensive scenario and it is not the best ammo to have here if you are not that confident in your shot placement (I know I am not... yet) so because of that I was thinking of a larger smaller calibre like .45 which not only is heavier but also much slower thus decreasing the possibility of overpenetration but also... It reduces the capacity I can carry especially with compacts or subcompacts.

So if I could chose whatever I want with whichever ammo I want I would be conflicted between CZ P-07 and H&K USP Compact in 9mm.
But as the things are I must think between the ones stated above. The problem is also a price the most expensive is a .45 right after that is 9mm Mak and almost at half the price of .45 lies the 9mm...

So there you have it and thanks for reading. :D
Any questions?

detailed as always...*nods*

I am that kind of lad to annoyance of my friends. :D

Yes,

.22LR for self defence?

I wouldn't recommend it. For first it doesn't have much power so shot placement the hardest skill of self defence with handgun is the most crucial with ammo as .22 LR. Secondly it's a rimmed and rimfired cartridge they tend to be less reliable that centerfired ones. And lastly if your adrenaline's pumping and you go forward the .22 is something you can shake off as they bury into you.
Yes .22 LR is deadly, but I wouldn't recommend it for a defensive ammunition without extensive training.

Ok...

Speaking of home defence, if using a shotgun, people reccomend bridshot since it does not damage much of surrounding.

True, false or there is a catch?

There is a catch. Yes birdshot is doing fairly well especially if you live in a block of flats but when the assailant ducks behind cover the birdshot do not have much of a penetration power so you might just get something destroyed without thwarting the threat itself. I think it is really situational it is best to know what are are you and living and then decide what you load from a birdshot continuing with OO buckshot to a slug. Generally people agree the OO buckshot is the most versatile but that I usually heard from people that live in a house not in a block of flats... I would refer you to my friends video (a retired US marine) where he talks about home defence guns. He has a good insight on defence of a flat because he mostly lived in ones but his channel on YT was taken down for reasons unknown to me.

So yeah shotguns are great defensive weapons for your home just do your research to choose the best suitable load for where you live.

*takes a shopping cart and goes shopping following the list*

A very nice discussion, it's a shame there's not that many who would/could join in to it.

For me, I am like Lance, my calibre of choice is the 9mm Parabellum. For many countries it is the standard pistol calibre for their militaries and is very popular(if not the most) in civilian market as well.

My pistol of choice would have to be a SiG Sauer M11A1, a compact version of the SiG P226.

Pros include for one compact size, making it easier to conceal carry during the day. Short Reset SA/DA trigger which is good for if you need to throw more lead down range faster and being able to go between single and double action is always a plus in my book. Full metal construction, while it may be a con for some people, I always love the feel of it and enjoying a pistol is an important factor in using it, I believe.

Situations I would most likely have to use it is in an outdoor environment most likely occurring at night, which is why I went for the M11A1 since it features Tritium night sights(though I could always have added those afterwards anyway). My country's law states that its illegal to carry a concealed weapon which can be anything a policeman stopping you deems is going to be used in an offensive manner. That said, concealment is a high on my list not only so that police can't see it but so can't my offender.

I have the philosophy that a weapon is to use not to show. In an engagement I'd rather not let my opponent know I'm armed until the point that I need to use it and that being said, I prefer to try and end my engagement without having to use them at all.

So to sum this up, my carry firearm of choice is the SiG M11A1 in 9mm Parabellum, conceal carried for the sake of having it when I need it, which hopefully is never.

.................

What about Glock? I like that one, although I don't remember why...

*is searching a new sleeping spot*

Glock is a reputable series of firearms, I do have a G19 that I take to the range every now and then. But personally I prefer other firearms over it, the stated M11A1 being one of them.

Also Glock have a meme among firearm enthusiasts of blowing up. Of course I should thank that mine hasn't blown up after the so many visits to the range.

If you'd like to Azelle, in the survival section are roll out mats and sleeping bags. That or I can give you the key to Kei's room.

lol, it tends to blow up?? Scary...

Nah, I'll find my own spot. Thanks for the offer, though.

Well I think the occurrence is less than what the meme would have you believe. I've only seen a gun blow up during use once in person and that was Kei's standard issued pistol.

I think the meme was because of some ass that was hot hand loading and spiced it up too much, or he was stupid enough to load lead casts into polygonal barrel or both.

Glocks are a weird one to me... I don't mind them per se but the one I had a chance to try (G19) doesn't really fit my hand. Maybe if I tried those Gen 4 with larger backstraps I would able able to find one that fits me well, but that sounds like major pain if I can get a nice grip on CZ or USP not to mention I know a place where I can get those cheaper than a new glock.

That's possible, a lot of memes have weird sometimes stupid origins.

Glock is certainly a pricey brand now, it's popularity has gone beyond the point where it's constantly pitted against the 1911, which I personally think is almost as bad as AK vs AR arguments.

Also, had to ride my bike for the first time in winter during the night and it was so bloody cold I could still feel it through my thick jacket. That being said our new topic of discussion for tonight(tomorrow) is:

"Survival in Cold Climate"

Since Lance and Data are both up north in Europe, you'd have some experience living with considerably cold climate. You can take this topic as far as you want but the general situation is that you're stranded in the middle of nowhere with only what you're able to carry.

What do you pack, what action would you take and so forth. I think it's an interesting topic to discuss, especially the survival aspect. But I'll leave it to the people online since I'm going to bed nows. Like before I'll pitch in my thoughts sometime after I wake up.

Well I actually had a mid February sleepover innawoods back in '11. Been so cold that my water half froze in my US military issue flask inside my backpack. I had a -12°C sleeping bag but still had to wrap my sweater around my feet to stop them from feeling freezing.
Been so fucking glad our CO made some hot coffee that morning and shared with us.
After that we spend all day running around the hill with abandoned surface mine hunting Russians and Germans with out USMC brothers. A note of personal observation: MARPAT and Flecktarn are really similar on distance.
A lot of guys gave up on first or second checkpoint... I just picked up a rifle of one of ours who gave up and carried on.

I had a shirt a wool sweater a fleece jacked under my blouse and was feeling cold...

I found out when I got my soft shell jacked that it helped me a lot with preserving my body temperature.
There are two steps how to keep warm. Get an air pocket or some other good isolation in between skin and outer environment and try not to sweat your shirt full of water (the ones that do not absorb water are really great for winter times). water is a killer for isolation because it works great as heatsink.

And thats why they put water cooling into high end rigs.

But lance is right. Air is terrible heat conductor.

Also, Lance, how was the wool sweater knitting? The way its knitted and quality wool makes huge diffrence. I remember when my grandma gave me one. That stuff was awesome. Design was all cutesy but i didnt mind that since it was more effective what I had back then. In the end i outgrew it, which sucked.

Mostly, when going to very cold areas, its good to properly wash yourself before the trip. It allows skin to breathe.